Attic wiring

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tonype

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I came across wiring in an attic (Type-NM wiring loosely laid on collar ties; wires from the collar ties to air handlers, wires between floor boards), etc. that I an "red-flagging" to my client (this was a home inspection). The owner says wiring was installed by an electrician. Am I off my hinges to think that this wiring has many problems?

Regards,
Tony Shupenko

PS: I was hoping to attach photos; however, the photo sizes are too large and will not upload (any suggestions?).
 
tonype said:
PS: I was hoping to attach photos; however, the photo sizes are too large and will not upload (any suggestions?).
Click to expand...
Look around in the software that handles your digital camera pictures: you can probably "Save As" a smaller file. Look for "Crop" in the menus to reduce the picture size.

I find it easier to edit my pictures before uploading, because I am on dial-up and uploading large pictures takes a day and a half. However, www.photobucket.com will automatically resize pictures that are too big for their liking, after you upload them. Opening an account there is free and easy.

Pictures would help a lot in this case, I for one can't picture what you're describing. :)
 
attic wiring

attic wiring

Thanks for the help on reducing picture size - here are some photos.

The attic is accessible from a fold-down stairway.

Regards,
Tony Shupenko
 
I would call it sloppy work.Hard to see if its staple right and some of the wires seem longer than 6 feet with no support.Any time i see them blue box's i think home owner was at big orange.From what i see i would say you should include in report that a licensed electrician is advised to look it over.
 
Definately sloppy work.
Many customers tell me, an electrician did it, or they thought he was an electrician, or it was the contractors man that did it.

Are you a Municpal city Inspector or a Home Buyers inspector?
Was this what you were called out to inspect? or are you looking beyond your inspection scope?

Then it also comes down to the common sense aspect.
Duh! Not doubt its not too code! But...
Will the HO pay someone to repair it properly?
Is it actually unsafe & a fire hazard?
 
I am an inspector for a prospective purchaser of the property, so it is in the scope of the inspection to look for unusual stuff. My usual approach to something like this (very unsual wiring methods) is to advise a full evaluation by a licensed electrical contractor (when confronted by a HO, I usually clam up, since past experience shows that it can become heated).

Some other items of note:

1. Alot of slack in a wire was sort of bunched together on top of an air handler.
2. Wires are not secured to the collar ties - just "gravity" support to the collar ties.
 
I am probably showing my ignorance here and contributing nothing to the discussion, but could someone tell me what on earth is a "collar tie"?:confused:
 
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A collar tie is the horizontal wood framing member that connects rafter pairs on either side of a ridge (peak) board. The collar tie makes the upside down "V" shape of a roof framing to look like an "A.

Tony Shupenko
 
tonype said:
A collar tie is the horizontal wood framing member that connects rafter pairs on either side of a ridge (peak) board. The collar tie makes the upside down "V" shape of a roof framing to look like an "A.

Tony Shupenko
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Thanks. I know what you are talking about now. Just never heard them called that. :D
 
wires are not required to be stapled to collar ties. It is no different then running romex accross the bottom cord of trusses. Messey job? YES. Safty hassard NO. leave it alone. If that inspection held up the sale of my house there would be a war.
 
Where do you see that NM cable is not required to be secured to the collar ties?
See 334.30
Nonmetallic-sheathed cable shall be supported and secured by staples, cable ties, straps, hangers. or similar fittings designed and installed so as not to damage the cable, at intervels not exceeding 4 1/2 ft.


I do not see where relief is given if the NM cable is installed over rafters or such type of framing.
 
Yes I am very aware of the 4 1/2 foot requirement. I also have been in the industry for 35 years and it does not happen in the real world.
 
In our adventures of crawling for dollars in attic we see everything!
But its not a monkey see monkey do world.
NM must be secured every 4.5 feet & then this brings up a question I think I know the answer to.
Can NM be run on roof rafters & collars ties?
As long as its secure & protected?
You tell me!
 
Cavie said:
Yes I am very aware of the 4 1/2 foot requirement. I also have been in the industry for 35 years and it does not happen in the real world.
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I agree, it doesn't. Shouldn't the code start to recognize this?
 
I took over a job that was bootlegged, unpermitted, then redtagged. The attic was a free king mess!
The wall were all sheetrock.
I had the inspector over for a walkthru & he said to uncover all the wiring in the walls. And all he said about the attic was to "Secure & Protect"
IMO without going into detail & NEC articles, that really sums up attic wiring.
 
The code does but I can tell you My boss would have a hart attack if I turned on down for that. Some secureing is required, Away from nail plates, attic access, a/c ducts etc and a few trusses but I have NEVER seen 4' ties
 
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