bathroom heat/vent in fire rated ceiling?

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flatlander

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Diamond bar, CA , Tempe AZ
I was looking for some information for installing a bath heat vent in a fire rated ceiling.
This is a remodel situation and we must use fire rated system for recessed lights.

I am stuck with the entire install as there is no mechanical guy.

I can see there is a housing from EZ barrier but it is not for these larger fans.

how do you guys handle it?
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flatlander said:
I was looking for some information for installing a bath heat vent in a fire rated ceiling.
This is a remodel situation and we must use fire rated system for recessed lights.

I am stuck with the entire install as there is no mechanical guy.

I can see there is a housing from EZ barrier but it is not for these larger fans.

how do you guys handle it?
.
Click to expand...
Probably with 5/8 sheetrock, multiple layers if necessary to get proper rating. Problem with an exhaust fan is there is still an exhaust duct to deal with.
 
flatlander said:
Yes the vent pipe is one of my concerns. How do you deal with it. Is the flapper included that is metal ok or do we need some sort of other device?
Click to expand...
I could see possibly being required to install a true "fire damper" at the required fire wall. Such damper might need to be accessible though as they have replaceable thermal "fuse links" that close the damper in high temp conditions.

Simplest thing is to keep the entire thing on one side of the fire barrier where possible.
 
flatlander said:
Yes the vent pipe is one of my concerns. How do you deal with it. Is the flapper included that is metal ok or do we need some sort of other device?
Click to expand...


Unless the fan you are buying has a fire rating equal to or greater than the required rating of the ceiling, you'll need a damper. This would be tough with the fan right there. I prefer to install the fan closer to the exhaust outlet to mitigate noise, in which case, having a damper at the ceiling (or in a rated enclave you build from fire resistant materials) is practical. You can use calculated fire resistance to come up with a prescriptive assembly, use a UL listing, reference the Gypsum Association files or one of many other sources.

Question: Why is it the electrician's responsibility to meet fire rating requirements? This should be on the GC. His crew needs to build that rated niche for the damper, using their design. You just put whatever wires they need wherever they need them.
 
mgookin said:
Unless the fan you are buying has a fire rating equal to or greater than the required rating of the ceiling, you'll need a damper. This would be tough with the fan right there. I prefer to install the fan closer to the exhaust outlet to mitigate noise, in which case, having a damper at the ceiling (or in a rated enclave you build from fire resistant materials) is practical. You can use calculated fire resistance to come up with a prescriptive assembly, use a UL listing, reference the Gypsum Association files or one of many other sources.

Question: Why is it the electrician's responsibility to meet fire rating requirements? This should be on the GC. His crew needs to build that rated niche for the damper, using their design. You just put whatever wires they need wherever they need them.
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Electrician may be the GC so to speak if the only major task is to install this exhaust fan, that don't mean he can't subcontract someone to build that rated niche though.

Add: looks like there probably was other work going on - but is no HVAC contractor involved.
 
flatlander said:
I was looking for some information for installing a bath heat vent in a fire rated ceiling.
This is a remodel situation and we must use fire rated system for recessed lights.

I am stuck with the entire install as there is no mechanical guy.

I can see there is a housing from EZ barrier but it is not for these larger fans.

how do you guys handle it?
.
Click to expand...

Sounds like you're committed to a fan. Make & model number please?
 
Try This

Try This

These folks have exactly what you're looking for. Hope there's enough room in the ceiling cavity for it.
 
In residential work I have been having gc line the bay with 5/8 drywall the whole way and venting out the side of the residence so the only penetration is out the side wall that they fire caulk
same with recessed
he builds a square of drywall and I install a regular ic rated can
building inspectors have approved every time
 
gadfly56 said:
Install a separate heater. Unless there are space constraints I can't see why there needs to be a combo unit.
Click to expand...

A heater- only unit will not require a ceiling penetration for its own outside air duct, even if it ends up ceiling mounted.

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GoldDigger said:

A heater- only unit will not require a ceiling penetration for its own outside air duct, even if it ends up ceiling mounted.

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Click to expand...

gadfly56 said:
Install a separate heater. Unless there are space constraints I can't see why there needs to be a combo unit.
Click to expand...

Because that is what the customer wants and expects.

gonna get expensive with a drywall box and fire damper.
 
I have not had to deal with this scenario yet.
This is may be one option:
How long of an exhaust run are we talking about, is it just isolated to the one bathroom before you reach the exterior wall. If so you should cut open the ceiling and fire rate the chase and have a contractor repair the ceiling.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do!
 
flatlander said:
Because that is what the customer wants and expects.

gonna get expensive with a drywall box and fire damper.
Click to expand...

Seems like the time to present them options with pricing and let them decide how much extra they want to spend to get a heat vent combo opposed to separate heat and vents.
 
We still haven't got a make & model number from OP.
There's not much to do without that info.
What's the building? Why is it rated? What is the hourly rating?
 
mgookin said:
We still haven't got a make & model number from OP.

it is a fan heat combo. How does the model affect anything. It size is greater than 16 Sqin
There's not much to do without that info.

how will this help you?
What's the building?
multi family

Why is it rated?

because the AHJ says so there is another unit above

What is the hourly rating?

I hour
Click to expand...

Do you really think that you can cut lots of new holes nils wily in a fire separation without mitigation?
Thanks for your input.
 
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