Bonding a nonconductive pool

[mark32]

How would you correctly bond the following using the '08 code: An inground, nonconductive pool shell dropped into it's excavated hole, then backfilled with dirt. A friend recently wired what I described above, he bonded the ladder cups and the pool light, nothing else. As I read 680:26, he should have, from my interpretation, installed a bonding grid beneath the shell, then extend that 3' from the pool or encircle the pool with #8 and bond it to the grid at least one time. Is this thinking correct?

 

[cowboyjwc]

This came up at our section meeting and I believe the correct answer is, you don't. Now I will have to read that section again as we have only done a few of these pools. You do still, as your friend did, bond all of the parts you normally would less the pool shell.

 

[mark32]

My buddy got lucky as the inspector wanted the grid; homeowner started to freak as he just had pavers put down, my friend's profit would have went out the window if the inspector didn't let him slide.

 

[mpd]

no the grid is not required under a vinyl liner pool or fiberglass pool, NFPA issued a TIA on this

but your buddy did install the grid under the pavers?

 

[mark32]

MPD, no, he did not install the perimeter bond (Under the pavers), that's why the inspector was giving him a hard time, that's why the homeowner was upset, and that's why my buddy couldn't sleep for two nights prior to the inspector passing the job I should mention this job was done under the '05 code.

 

[mpd]

mark32

I cannot believe any inspector would let that slide, so you are telling me that a brand new pool is not code compliant, so the inspector & contractor failed to provide the owner with the minimum requirements of the NEC, I am sure DCA would love to know that there is an inspector who would let that slide, a pool is no place to give breaks

 

[steelersman]

mark32

I cannot believe any inspector would let that slide, so you are telling me that a brand new pool is not code compliant, so the inspector & contractor failed to provide the owner with the minimum requirements of the NEC, I am sure DCA would love to know that there is an inspector who would let that slide, a pool is no place to give breaks

not really a big deal IMO

 

[brantmacga]

i do a lot of fiberglass jobs and don't put any bonding grid in. Usually, there's no bonding whatsoever because 95% of them don't install handrails anymore and both of my fiberglass pool contractors use fiber optic or LED pool lights; the small surface area of those fixtures makes them less likely to leak on the curved surface of the shell.

at my last CEU code update class, the instructor said we are supposed to be installing a grid, and also wrapping the shell of the pool w/ #8 copper. He had a couple of pics of these installs. I couldn't find anything in the code to back this up, so I never did it. The only code he referenced was the one about bonding the rebar in the shell; I didn't see where that applied to fiberglass.

I had an inspector red tag me because he wanted a ground rod driven next to the pump and bonded to it since there was no equipotential grid. He couldn't show me in the code either so it passed w/o the rod.

 

[mpd]

not really a big deal IMO

a brand new pool that does not comply with the 05 NEC is no big deal, your kidding right?

 

[dnem]

mark32

I cannot believe any inspector would let that slide, so you are telling me that a brand new pool is not code compliant, so the inspector & contractor failed to provide the owner with the minimum requirements of the NEC, I am sure DCA would love to know that there is an inspector who would let that slide, a pool is no place to give breaks

not really a big deal IMO

Correct pool bonding is one of the biggest life safety issues in the NEC !!

 

[dnem]

i do a lot of fiberglass jobs and don't put any bonding grid in. Usually, there's no bonding whatsoever because 95% of them don't install handrails anymore and both of my fiberglass pool contractors use fiber optic or LED pool lights; the small surface area of those fixtures makes them less likely to leak on the curved surface of the shell.

at my last CEU code update class, the instructor said we are supposed to be installing a grid, and also wrapping the shell of the pool w/ #8 copper.

You might be doing it right, you might be doing it wrong. . It depends on which of 3 NEC options applies right now in your municipality, '05NEC, '05NEC with TIA, or '08NEC. . Then you need to separate your shell answer from your 3 possible perimeter answers. . Your perimeter question must be answered separately from your shell question.

'05 shell contour
'05 with TIA shell contour
'08 shell contour

'05 paved perimeter
'05 unpaved perimeter
'08 perimeter [all]

The following is for no metal in the pool and no rebar under the pool and no metal in the perimeter

'05 shell contour
You're in violation. . You must add a grid under the 100% nonmetalic pool shell

'05 with TIA shell contour
You're OK, no bonding under the 100% nonmetalic pool shell required

'08 shell contour
You're OK, no bonding under the 100% nonmetalic pool shell required

'05 paved perimeter
You're in violation. . You must add a grid under the 3 foot 100% nonmetalic paved perimeter of the pool. . Check with your inspector to see if he'll accept wire mesh

'05 unpaved perimeter
You're OK, no bonding under the unpaved perimeter required

'08 perimeter [all]
You're in violation. . You must add a grid OR a loop under the 3 foot perimeter of the all pools, no exceptions. . If you choose the loop option, its installation must follow some very specific specs that are found at 680.26(B)(2)(b) and if the pool does have metalin the shell, that loop must attach to the shell at 4 uniformly spaced tails, see 680.26(B)(2).

 

[dnem]

How would you correctly bond the following using the '08 code:

..... I should mention this job was done under the '05 code.

You're giving confusing information from post to post on which code you're under

no the grid is not required under a vinyl liner pool or fiberglass pool, NFPA issued a TIA on this

Is his municipality under the '05 TIA ? . The TIA does NOT come automatically. . Your municipality must adopt it.

It really doesn't matter to me what the answers to these questions are because I posted the right answer to every option in my last post. . But for you Mark, as the installer, you'd better find out which answer applies according to your local or state laws.

You need to know which of the 3 codes you are currently under
'05NEC
'05NEC with 680.26 TIA
'08NEC
Then see my previous post for the correct answers. . One answer for the pool shell and a separate answer for the pool perimeter.

edited because I can't spell to save my life

 

[mark32]

Thanks for the replies,

dnem, I am not the installer but I was on the job w/my buddy (The EC) the day the pool was dropped in. The job was done under the '05 code but I was only trying to confirm my interpretation of the '08 code if ever faced with the same install, hence the different code years in my initial post.