box hooked to panel to save money

[kwired]

141201-1123 EST

Correcting power factor at the main panel does nothing to reduce line losses that the customer pays for. Normally there are only a few feet of wire between the panel and the meter.

And the main panel is where these whole house PF boxes are installed.

.

I agree but I disagree.

To say line losses are not reduced IMO is wrong. To say the losses reduced is at such a low level that it doesn't even effect the energy bill IMO is an accurate statement. So though those devices are not hurting anything they are not going to give you any significant payback, and in majority of cases will not really payback at all unless you want to calculate the energy bill in hundredths or even thousandths of a cent divisions - which at those levels would still never pay for purchasing or installing the device in the first place, but it may make some happy that they have a "greener" carbon footprint:roll:

 

[iceworm]

... To say line losses are not reduced IMO is wrong. To say the losses reduced is at such a low level that it doesn't even effect the energy bill IMO is an accurate statement. So though those devices are not hurting anything they are not going to give you any significant payback, and in majority of cases will not really payback at all unless you want to calculate the energy bill in hundredths or even thousandths of a cent divisions - which at those levels would still never pay for purchasing or installing the device in the first place, but it may make some happy that they have a "greener" carbon footprint:roll:

As I recall from the original discussions (some years back):
As noted, residential does not pay for VARS - so no help there.

And also as noted, there is a slight payback in line losses from the device connection point to the meter. Any losses in the line between the device connection point to the low pf equipment are still there. So there are the losses from the main panel to the meter - say 10 feet of 4/0.

However, there was comment about that is not even true. The "Power Saving" device is a cap bank. So, if sized exactly right, it will cancel the current due to the lagging pf of a motor. But, only while the motor is running. While the motor is not running, the cap bank is now drawing leading current that is not canceled out. So if the motor runs less than 50%, there are more losses in the 10 feet of 4/0 than there would be with out the "Power Saving" Device.

Although, as kwired said, one would need to calculate in the $.00001 range to see it.

These are an absolute fraud - there is no payback.

ice