BRK Smoke Alarms

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goldstar

goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
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Electrical Contractor
Has anyone has experience with these smoke alarms ? :

http://www.brkelectronics.com/product/SA520B#TabbedPanelsTab3

If I'm understanding the cut sheet correctly you need as least one 120V unit and the others can be wireless and battery operated. I'm looking today at a house built in 2002 that had a LV system installed but was never maintained and is now non-functional. The fire inspector in my town tells me that either the SD system has to be placed in working order and monitored by a central station or hard-wired smoke alarms have to be installed. In addition he tells me that ALL the BRK units have to be 120V units but the interconnect wire is not needed.

Any input would be appreciated (including opinions). Thanks.
 
You may have an amendment in your area. If this is a rental that may have something to do with it but around here there is no rule that can force the installation of smokes especially not hardwired. If work is done in the house, ie a building permit then we have to use wired smokes in the areas that are required if the sheetrock is removed, otherwise battery smokes can be used.
 
I found this

72-106 NATIONAL FIRE AlARM CODE
11.5.1.1 Smoke Detection. Where required by applicable
laws, codes, or standards for the specified occupancy, approved
single- and multiple-station smoke alarms shall be installed
as follows:
(1) In all sleeping rooms
Exception: Smoke alarms shall not be required in sleeping rooms in
existing one- and two-family dwelling units.

(2) Outside of each separate sleeping area, in the immediate
vicinity of the sleeping rooms
(3) On each level of the dwelling unit, including basements
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Dennis Alwon said:
You may have an amendment in your area. If this is a rental that may have something to do with it but around here there is no rule that can force the installation of smokes especially not hardwired. If work is done in the house, ie a building permit then we have to use wired smokes in the areas that are required if the sheetrock is removed, otherwise battery smokes can be used.
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Thanks Dennis. I'm thinking that the original HO's circumvented the hard-wired rule by installing a LV system. A second family purchased the house and I'm assuming that the LV system was probably working at the time but they didn't maintain it. Now I'm just wondering if this 2nd HO (who is looking to sell the house) has to bear the burden of installing a hard-wired system because the original HO didn't do so.
 
goldstar said:
Thanks Dennis. I'm thinking that the original HO's circumvented the hard-wired rule by installing a LV system. A second family purchased the house and I'm assuming that the LV system was probably working at the time but they didn't maintain it. Now I'm just wondering if this 2nd HO (who is looking to sell the house) has to bear the burden of installing a hard-wired system because the original HO didn't do so.
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It's possible that the LV system was installed because the required coverage could not be obtained due to the 12 detector limit for hard-wired smoke alarms. If that's the case, the LV system will need to be put back in order anyway. Really, how hard can it be?
 
I just received word back from the NJ-DCA. Because this house was built in 2002, smoke alarms had to have to been 120V hard wired and interconnected. The BRK wireless transmission units are acceptable as long as they are hard-wired. I don't know how they got away with the LV system when the house was built. In any event, they told me that each smoke alarms can be tapped off a receptacle (in say a bedroom) and placed on the wall at least 12" from the ceiling. Combination units are also required in the bedroom hallway(s) and can be installed in the same manner.

They also said that the LV system was not an acceptable type installation. The logic was that ALL devices report back to one "brain" or control unit. If you lose that brain (for whatever reason) ALL devices are rendered inoperative. Whereas, if you have individual smoke alarms, if one goes bad you don't lose the whole system.

Looks like I'll be going back to give her an estimate.
 
I don';t see how they can enforce that if it was accepted in 2002. Heck they can't go into old houses and say afci and gfci is needed.....Seems like they screwed up and now they want your customer to pay for it.

I think they should have sd so it ain't all bad but to force it....
 
goldstar said:
I just received word back from the NJ-DCA. Because this house was built in 2002, smoke alarms had to have to been 120V hard wired and interconnected. The BRK wireless transmission units are acceptable as long as they are hard-wired. I don't know how they got away with the LV system when the house was built. In any event, they told me that each smoke alarms can be tapped off a receptacle (in say a bedroom) and placed on the wall at least 12" from the ceiling. Combination units are also required in the bedroom hallway(s) and can be installed in the same manner.

They also said that the LV system was not an acceptable type installation. The logic was that ALL devices report back to one "brain" or control unit. If you lose that brain (for whatever reason) ALL devices are rendered inoperative. Whereas, if you have individual smoke alarms, if one goes bad you don't lose the whole system.

Looks like I'll be going back to give her an estimate.
Click to expand...
See my reply above. If the house is large enough, like a McMansion, the hard-wired smoke alarms may not have been able to cover all the required areas. In 2002, it's possible that the local AHJ granted a variance for the LV system to achieve the code intent. If the original fire subcode official is still there, he/she might remember that. He/she may or may not be the same as the fire inspector.
 
gadfly56 said:
See my reply above. If the house is large enough, like a McMansion, the hard-wired smoke alarms may not have been able to cover all the required areas. In 2002, it's possible that the local AHJ granted a variance for the LV system to achieve the code intent. If the original fire subcode official is still there, he/she might remember that. He/she may or may not be the same as the fire inspector.
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There are only 9 devices in the house plus heat detectors in the attic and garage on the LV system. I'm not required to install 120V devices there that I'm aware of.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I don';t see how they can enforce that if it was accepted in 2002. Heck they can't go into old houses and say afci and gfci is needed.....Seems like they screwed up and now they want your customer to pay for it.

I think they should have sd so it ain't all bad but to force it....
Click to expand...
I think the same thing every time I come across these situations. But I live in a lake community and years ago people did a lot of unscrupulous things up here. I don't know what happened with this particular house. However, I've had others where there was work done on the house or an addition put on subsequent to 1974 and smoke alarms were required at the time but never installed. That seems to be how the bldg. dept. is going back in time and requiring these smoke alarms. They are also inspecting houses on EVERY resale to make sure they are or were up to Code at the time. They are also requiring HO's to install fire extinguishers in $50K kitchens MOUNTED on walls or cabinets
 
Just an FYI and I just found this out yesterday, BRK makes a unit that is 120V hard-wired and all other outlying smoke and or CO alarms are battery operated and report back to the 120V unit as the master. All alarms will sound together. THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE by the NJ DCA. ALL units have to be 120V hard-wired, with 10 year LI battery back-up. If it is not possible to run (3-wire) interconnect wiring, Kidde makes 120V units that will transmit wire-lessly to other 120V installed units. As an example and with respect to installation, you can tap off a bedroom receptacle and install a smoke alarm 12" below the ceiling line in each required area.
 
goldstar said:
There are only 9 devices in the house plus heat detectors in the attic and garage on the LV system. I'm not required to install 120V devices there that I'm aware of.
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OK, with that information, the home owner is toast. I forget which year of the NJ residential code had it where LV systems could be substituted without approval by the AHJ, but with that coverage no AHJ would have given a hardship variance in 2002. A clear code violation at the time of install. They could have installed the LV system, as long as they also had the 120VAC smoke alarms. I'm curious as to whether the DCA will allow the 120VAC smoke alarms with a wireless interconnect. It should be OK because I don't think the regular hard-wired devices supervise the interconnect to see if all the devices are connected.
 
It’s possible they were there during the inspection, but the home owner had them removed and hot patched over because they didn’t like the looks of them. Might look for any unusual bumps in the ceilings, might get lucky!
 
Thank you all for your replies. Just an FYI, the HO e-mailed me this morning and decided to get an alarm co. to re-activate her system and get it re-inspected.
 
Ived used the kiddie wireless ones in Bergen county . One unit is wired the rest are remotes .My understanding is they are approved by the state .
 
Jerseydaze said:
Ived used the kiddie wireless ones in Bergen county . One unit is wired the rest are remotes .My understanding is they are approved by the state .
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Sorry I'm just getting back to you on this but I'm not getting notified when there's a response to a thread that I'm involved in. Yes, the "wireless" ones are approved but these are still 120V wired. You just don't need the (red) inter-connecting wire. That means you can tap off a receptacle in a bedroom and install the 120V smoke alarm on the wall below the ceiling line. It is my understanding that you are not permitted to use battery operated units as the remotes. Check with the DCA - Mike Whelan
 
goldstar said:
Sorry I'm just getting back to you on this but I'm not getting notified when there's a response to a thread that I'm involved in. Yes, the "wireless" ones are approved but these are still 120V wired. You just don't need the (red) inter-connecting wire. That means you can tap off a receptacle in a bedroom and install the 120V smoke alarm on the wall below the ceiling line. It is my understanding that you are not permitted to use battery operated units as the remotes. Check with the DCA - Mike Whelan
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When you say "not permitted" do you mean in new construction, or retrofit where hard-wired wasn't originally required, or both?

I've spoken to Mike a couple of times. Good people.
 
gadfly56 said:
When you say "not permitted" do you mean in new construction, or retrofit where hard-wired wasn't originally required, or both?

I've spoken to Mike a couple of times. Good people.
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I don't believe they are allowed for new construction. You'll have to check with Mike Whelan on this. I'm hesitant to call him again because he got kind of irritated with me the last time we spoke. The impression I got was as I stated regarding the installation of "wireless" smoke alarms. Also a lot has to do with when a house was built or renovated. This is a re-print of of NJ-CCC article :


If you look through this Summer 2017 there's a article in there regarding wireless smoke alarms


Regards,

Phil
 
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