Cable in conduit

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carl.arnsdorff

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We have a Type W 5 conductor (L1, L2, L3, N & G) cable supplying 480 VAC that may be installed in conduit depending on the specific installation site. Some sites may use the cable to connect the to pieces of equipment if they are close and other sites may install the cable in conduit if the two pieces are located some distance apart.

Is there any additional derating that must be done to account for the installation in a conduit?
 
carl.arnsdorff said:
We have a Type W 5 conductor (L1, L2, L3, N & G) cable supplying 480 VAC that may be installed in conduit depending on the specific installation site. Some sites may use the cable to connect the to pieces of equipment if they are close and other sites may install the cable in conduit if the two pieces are located some distance apart.

Is there any additional derating that must be done to account for the installation in a conduit?
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Is this rubber cord permitted in a raceway? 400.8(6)
 
If you're asking me I don't know.

The cable is UL listed for the equipment. However, it is unclear to me if the cable can be installed in conduit.:confused:
 
Let me ask the question differently.

Is there a reason this Type W cord (UL listed with the equipment) cannot be used in conduit? If not, is there a flexible multiconductor cable that could be used?

There is another power cable (3 conductor, 230 VAC) with a similar situation and is required to be installed in a raceway (typically conduit).
 
400.14 allows you to "sleeve" cord for lengths not more thn 50 ft in industrial aaplications aND DERting must be taken into consideration per 400.5
 
It was chosen to be similar to other parts of the system which use power cable routed in conduit.
It is terminated in terminals inside the equipment. The leads have ferules crimped on the end and inserted in the terminals.
 
sight unseen, it appears such installation might be a violation of 400.8 (1).

assuming it's not, and you have not mentioned cable size, but you would need to keep in mind Note 9 of Chapter 9 tables (pg 70-671). The leagl size conduit might be large.
 
The 5 wire cable is #1 and the 3 wire cable is #10.

Does 400.7 (8) not allow this or is the term appliance mean particular types of equipment?

For what it's worth - this came from a discussion that the installers of this type of equipment claimed the use of a cable for the equipment required conduit per code. Additionally, they have been installing the German portion for years and the cable on the German equipment was deemed okay because it exits from the bottom of the cabinet and is at floor level when it comes from the equipment and our portion of the equipment has the cable exit from the rear. The German equipment cable then must enter a trough or conduit at this point. 1000s of this type of equipment is installed worldwide each year.
 
Pierre C Belarge said:
The codes are different world wide.

I cannot say for sure about your installation, as I am not there to witness it, but from what I am reading, this is not compliant.
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Unless we are talking about a temporary installation, I would agree,,
not NEC compliant
 
Is the 5 wire Type W cable compliant if it is UL listed with the equipment and not installed in conduit?
The wire is used to supply power from one piece of equipment to another in the same equipment room - typically immediately adjacent but may be several feet apart. The cable is preferred for quick installation and service of the equipment.
 
I agree that this installation is questionable as far a being NEC compliant (for reasons already listed).

Are you aware that you may not terminate the conductors in this cable under the screws of breakers or mechanical lugs? You will need to use pin connectors (compression) or compression lugs.
 
Even though the cable is UL listed with the equipment it is still a code violation?

Also, please explain abput the termination. They do not go to a breaker but do go to terminals.
 
carl.arnsdorff said:
Even though the cable is UL listed with the equipment it is still a code violation?
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If this is the case, why are you running a conduit?
Also, please explain abput the termination. They do not go to a breaker but do go to terminals.
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Most termination points are not rated to accept the very fine strand of wire in the type W cable. What kind of terminals are they going to?
 
Ok - I did understand about the wire strands. The cable leads have ferules crimped.

There are two reasons for the conduit. The installer brought up that the shorter cable (20') was required to be in conduit. I mentioned in my first post that this cable was UL listed with the equipment.

The second reason is we would like to make the second longer power wire a a cable for ease of installation and service.

If we were to UL list the cable in the conduit would it be acceptable?
 
You really need to take a close look at 400.7 & 400.8 (especially 400.7{b}) and see if the equipment meets any of that criteria.
 
I really don't understand the references to section 400. Will each local inspector in the US apply the sections based on their interpretation regardless of the UL listing and the manufacturers informartion.

Is the UL rating even worth the cost?

How can any piece of equipment be supplied with a power cord?.
 
carl.arnsdorff said:
I really don't understand the references to section 400. Will each local inspector in the US apply the sections based on their interpretation regardless of the UL listing and the manufacturers informartion.

Is the UL rating even worth the cost?

How can any piece of equipment be supplied with a power cord?.
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Sorry National Electrical Code. Art 400.7 & 400.8 (pgs 247 & 248 in the '08 Code)
Each agency can and will make their own determination.
Some areas will not accept the installation of equipment that does not bear a U.L. (or NRTL) label.
IMHO, if this cord is factory supplied as part of the equipment and is being used to connect two sections of a UL listed piece of equipment, you probably won't have a problem with most inspectors.
If you are using this cord to supply power to the equipment, or you are using it in lieu of "hard pipe" then some may see it as a violation of NEC 400.8
 
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