Cables Stuffed in One Large Hole

Status
Not open for further replies.
E

ESolar

Senior Member
Location
Eureka, CA Humboldt County
Occupation
Electrician/Contractor
This is the subpanel in my own home (it was existing, I did not install it, and it was approved by the City). Now the question is: Do I take the time to fix it! Requires getting into the sheetrock to deal with the middle/feeder clamp. And is there enough slack to get those cables to individual clamps? Maybe with clamps listed for 3 or 4 cables and move them to an adjacent hole.
1674880787894.png
 
Very poor workmanship. The wires to the CB at bottom right can neatened up, as can the entire panel
Cut out Sheetrock at top, install 2x4 above
panel. Pull cables out and run thru connectors. Staple on 2x4. Reterminate and dress.
Send new picture
 
tom baker said:
Very poor workmanship. The wires to the CB at bottom right can neatened up, as can the entire panel
Cut out Sheetrock at top, install 2x4 above
panel. Pull cables out and run thru connectors. Staple on 2x4. Reterminate and dress.
Send new picture
Click to expand...

IMO, tract homes, multi family dwellings, are built as cheap as they can get away with, I refuse to say built to minimum code, slap it together move to the next job, resulting as shown in the OP's photo.
 
Does the SER cable come through the same opening as the NM cables?

I would also bet if you looked at the panel this feeds from its #2 AL on a 100 amp breaker.

BTW What NM clamps are listed for 3/4 cables?

Thanks
 
nizak said:
Does the SER cable come through the same opening as the NM cables?

I would also bet if you looked at the panel this feeds from its #2 AL on a 100 amp breaker.

BTW What NM clamps are listed for 3/4 cables?

Thanks
Click to expand...
Are you asking which ones are listed for 3/4 inch width or diameter or are you asking which ones are listed for up to 3 or 4 cables to be installed in them?
 
The main thing is, yes, that looks very sloppy....what else can't you see in the house?
 
nizak said:
Does the SER cable come through the same opening as the NM cables?

I would also bet if you looked at the panel this feeds from its #2 AL on a 100 amp breaker.

BTW What NM clamps are listed for 3/4 cables?

Thanks
Click to expand...
It is #2 AL SER - but on a 70A breaker. However, I am going to up that to 90A and run a #6 on a 40A for EV. When I first looked at it, they had the Neutral and Ground from the SER reversed. So not only poor workmanship, but dangerous. I don't think that it currently presents a hazard - more of an annoyance.

I don't know why they don't upsize the feeder cables. On the flip side, the new rules get you 90A on the AL SER.

Arlington NM840 series clamps to multiple cables. They even have a retrofit, install from inside box. There are others as well.
 
Last edited:
ESolar said:
It is #2 AL SER - but on a 70A breaker. However, I am going to up that to 90A and run a #6 on a 40A for EV. When I first looked at it, they had the Neutral and Ground from the SER reversed. So not only poor workmanship, but dangerous. I don't think that it currently presents a hazard - more of an annoyance.

I don't know why they don't upsize the feeder cables. On the flip side, the new rules get you 90A on the AL SER.

Arlington NM840 series clamps to multiple cables. They even have a retrofit, install from inside box. There are others as well.
Click to expand...
And yes through same opening.
 
if my home I would leave it if that is the only thing that needs address and no other Sheetrock work is needed around house.
It’s not really that unsafe and if your worried about ark flash getting in there or derby, just fill with duct seal.
I would tell homeowner to address the code violation though!

Fix it when you sell the home in the future.
 
Is that a MLO panel or a 100A MB with feed through lugs? Looks like it could be a 100A MB installed upside down.

Either way, if it's just a subpanel and in my own house, I might neaten up the wires some and leave it as is as far as the cables. I might add some retro NM connectors at the bottom where there are none.
 
The way the cables in the large hole are pushed away from the front of the bushing suggests that they at least used a cable clamp rather than a male adapter, which I could live with.

Sadly, it looks like new work that was done like a shoddy replacement job.
 
LarryFine said:
The way the cables in the large hole are pushed away from the front of the bushing suggests that they at least used a cable clamp rather than a male adapter, which I could live with.

Sadly, it looks like new work that was done like a shoddy replacement job.
Click to expand...
There is no specific top/bottom to that panel. From what he says in OP pretty certain the SE cable is the feeder to this so that bottom breaker is either a branch circuit or an outgoing feeder.

Those "black button" NM connectors would be able to be installed without even needing to disconnect anything.
 
kwired said:
There is no specific top/bottom to that panel. From what he says in OP pretty certain the SE cable is the feeder to this so that bottom breaker is either a branch circuit or an outgoing feeder.

Those "black button" NM connectors would be able to be installed without even needing to disconnect anything.
Click to expand...
The bottom breaker is for solar - I added it. The main breaker for the subpanel is 70A and located in the main panel. There is a large cable clamp in the large knockout. The two NM in the bottom come through a plastic push clamp.

I noticed that the Neutral wires for those two circuits that enter from the bottom are capped and not connected to the neutral bar. They go to lights in a bathroom and living room and the hots are on 15 amp breakers. Now I am curious - why were the neutrals capped on those two circuits? Did they use a neutral from another circuit? Did they not use a neutral? Did they blow it and decide to use the ground?
 
Last edited:
I have no issue with the wires coming in the top thru a piece of pvc or even just a pvc connector. I have this install so many times around here in past years. My own panel has 3 - 2" pvc conduits going up with the house circuits run thru them. Legal as the 2" pvc is only 16" and the panel is surface mounted.

I realize that the install is not compliant in the picture however I don't see danger in it. If it is just a 2" connector then fill it with duct seal.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I have no issue with the wires coming in the top thru a piece of pvc or even just a pvc connector. I have this install so many times around here in past years. My own panel has 3 - 2" pvc conduits going up with the house circuits run thru them. Legal as the 2" pvc is only 16" and the panel is surface mounted.

I realize that the install is not compliant in the picture however I don't see danger in it. If it is just a 2" connector then fill it with duct seal.
Click to expand...
What about the two NM circuits that come through the bottom and that have their neutrals capped (not landing on the neutral bar). Any idea why they might have done that? I may have to go exploring.
 
ESolar said:
What about the two NM circuits that come through the bottom and that have their neutrals capped (not landing on the neutral bar). Any idea why they might have done that? I may have to go exploring.
Click to expand...

I have no idea but it appears those wires were added so I would go under the panel and see where those cables go.
 
ESolar said:
What about the two NM circuits that come through the bottom and that have their neutrals capped (not landing on the neutral bar). Any idea why they might have done that? I may have to go exploring.
Click to expand...
Are you sure those neutrals don't go to those GFCI breakers? They wouldn't go to the neutral bar.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top