Can switching GFCI recept cause failure

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ritelec

ritelec

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Jersey
Hi. Installed an outside square permapost that holds a receptacle for someone about 4 years back.
I replaced the original WR GFCI installed receptacle a couple years back with another and now I just received a call that the newer one is not resetting.

It is tapped off the post light switched leg.


Besides the environment do you think turning it on and off everyday could cause it to prematurely fail ? Thank you.
 
1) what type of light is it?
2) you say "not resetting", so I ask, "why was it tripping?" Is there anything plugged into the recept?
 
Little Bill said:
No
Did you find moisture, or signs of it, when you changed the receptacle?
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If memory serves it was bone dry
curt swartz said:
Are you sure they have the switch on when trying to reset?
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yes. He mentioned the red light on the gfi is on and also the post light
FionaZuppa said:
1) what type of light is it?
2) you say "not resetting", so I ask, "why was it tripping?" Is there anything plugged into the recept?
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The receptacle is installed before the post light. I extended the original uf with an underground splice kit. Fed to the permapost and spliced line into feed gfci and line to feed light post (probably has a led bulb)

He’s installing Christmas lights which I think is what he was doing 2 years ago when he noticed it wasn’t working.
He was pushing the button in with a screw driver and it wasn’t holding. Nothing plugged in.

I’ll check for moister. And swap it out. Was just wandering if turning on and off 730 times had anything to do with it.


Thank you.
 
Does the house have an SPD? Living in the country with above ground electric service I used to loose 1 or 2 a summer after a storm before I installed an SPD.
 
ritelec said:
I’ll check for moister. And swap it out. Was just wandering if turning on and off 730 times had anything to do with it.


Thank you.
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So the gfi itself in on the switch leg. Turning on/off 730x may just be it. I don't know for sure if that is the cause, but the gfi itself would heat cycle with every on/off. It's very possible the electronics have fell victim to on/off heat fatigue.
 
221205-1730 EST

Any electrical device built with semiconductors is quite intolerant of over voltage, especially inexpensive units. All electrical circuits have some or more inductance. Switching any circuit which includes inductance is likely to produce large switching transients. One time I tested an 8 ft Slimline fixture and produced several thousand volts switching transients.

To provide some protection for electronic circuits it maybe useful to put some transient limiter across the electronic device. But these don't clamp very tightly and still may not provide total protection, but may reduce the probability of failure.

.
 
gar said:
Any electrical device built with semiconductors is quite intolerant of over voltage, especially inexpensive units. All electrical circuits have some or more inductance. Switching any circuit which includes inductance is likely to produce large switching transients. One time I tested an 8 ft Slimline fixture and produced several thousand volts switching transients.

To provide some protection for electronic circuits it maybe useful to put some transient limiter across the electronic device. But these don't clamp very tightly and still may not provide total protection, but may reduce the probability of failure.
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Very good points, gar. GFCI devices typically contain a MOV (Metal Oxide Varistor). Their effectiveness in clamping overvoltages gets successively degraded after suppressing surges, therefore leaving the electronics within a GFCI more vulnerable to such surges.

https://www.powerelectronictips.com/teardown-leviton-ground-fault-circuit-interrupter/

https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/7468160
 
With most new self testing GFCIs, it goes through a test cycle every time power is applied. I’ve heard that in some brands, they keep track of that and when the firmware detects a certain number of tests, it triggers the Fail response because it is assuming that this is indicative of age.

On one of mine that’s on a switch that I use to power a fountain pump, I get periodic Failure LEDs when I first power it up after a long time. But I can hit the Test button, then it will reset. The instructions said to do that before assuming the unit is bad and so far, it has worked every time for the last 8 or so years. Worth a try.
 
Some of the newer GFCI's that jraef referred to will not reset mechanically when power is off, and may possibly fail to reset when power is reapplied unless the reset button is then pushed. I think it may depend on whether or not the GFCI was in the tripped state when the power went off.
The programmably set number of resets allowed may also be part or all of the problem here. I doubt that the manufacturer makes any effort to publicize this feature, although it may appear as part of the NRTL certification document.
 
GoldDigger said:
Some of the newer GFCI's that jraef referred to will not reset mechanically when power is off, and may possibly fail to reset when power is reapplied unless the reset button is then pushed. I think it may depend on whether or not the GFCI was in the tripped state when the power went off.
The programmably set number of resets allowed may also be part or all of the problem here. I doubt that the manufacturer makes any effort to publicize this feature, although it may appear as part of the NRTL certification document.
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I will say I have noticed more units that no longer will reset in recent years than I used to. Some not had much use at all, indoors/outdoors doesn't seem to matter. That internal lockout after so many trips could very well be true.
 
mopowr steve said:
Also, are you using Weather Resistant GFCI
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That likely doesn't matter. They mostly the same thing but with corrosion resistant (likely an alloy in the stainless steel family in many cases) for receptacle contacts and maybe corrosion resistant mounting screws instead of plain untreated screws.
 
kwired said:
That likely doesn't matter. They mostly the same thing but with corrosion resistant (likely an alloy in the stainless steel family in many cases) for receptacle contacts and maybe corrosion resistant mounting screws instead of plain untreated screws.
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And potted circuit boards
 
17 posts in, did I miss it? What make/model is the gfi?
 
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