Change order.

[yordanys]

Good Morning Everyone,

I need your advice, please. I just finished a job installing 30 LED 2x4 lights, the job is completed, I submit all my daily and submitted also my AIA method of payment to the GC company. After a week of me finishing the job, the GC in charge of the project called to tell me the type B light I installed had a reflectors delivery and they want them to be installed, by the way, they are providing the lighting and never told me about these reflectors. it looks Like I have to go back and do the job all over again. Should I submit a change order for this? I'll greatly appreciate your advice. Thank you in advance

 

[Little Bill]

What does the contract state?

 

[hbiss]

This is what happens when you allow the customer to provide the materials. Just tell the GC sorry, the job is complete. If there are additional items to be installed that you just had delivered and were not here when we started the job there will be an additional charge.

-Hal

 

[gadfly56]

Good Morning Everyone,

I need your advice, please. I just finished a job installing 30 LED 2x4 lights, the job is completed, I submit all my daily and submitted also my AIA method of payment to the GC company. After a week of me finishing the job, the GC in charge of the project called to tell me the type B light I installed had a reflectors delivery and they want them to be installed, by the way, they are providing the lighting and never told me about these reflectors. it looks Like I have to go back and do the job all over again. Should I submit a change order for this? I'll greatly appreciate your advice. Thank you in advance

If the reflectors were part of the base installation instructions, you may be out of luck. On the other hand, if they were an option and no one mentioned them, a change order would be justified.

I note you mention AIA. Jobs of this sort have a fair degree of formality. If the fixtures were supplied by others there should be an approved submittal which they should have given you a copy of. If the reflectors are noted/highlighted in the submittal, that might weaken your argument for a change order. On the other hand, if they aren't shown in the submittal, change order time it is.

 

[yordanys]

If the reflectors were part of the base installation instructions, you may be out of luck. On the other hand, if they were an option and no one mentioned them, a change order would be justified.

I note you mention AIA. Jobs of this sort have a fair degree of formality. If the fixtures were supplied by others there should be an approved submittal which they should have given you a copy of. If the reflectors are noted/highlighted in the submittal, that might weaken your argument for a change order. On the other hand, if they aren't shown in the submittal, change order time it is.

Thank you very much. I really appreciate your advice

 

[yordanys]

If the reflectors were part of the base installation instructions, you may be out of luck. On the other hand, if they were an option and no one mentioned them, a change order would be justified.

I note you mention AIA. Jobs of this sort have a fair degree of formality. If the fixtures were supplied by others there should be an approved submittal which they should have given you a copy of. If the reflectors are noted/highlighted in the submittal, that might weaken your argument for a change order. On the other hand, if they aren't shown in the submittal, change order time it is.

that is exactly what I thought, no one mentioned the reflector I would wait for them to be delivered before I start the lighting installation. they just gave me the light and told me those are the light to install.

 

[cdslotz]

that is exactly what I thought, no one mentioned the reflector I would wait for them to be delivered before I start the lighting installation. they just gave me the light and told me those are the light to install.

Were there submittals of these fixtures submitted to the EE from the GC?...If so, they should have copied you on them

 

[Hv&Lv]

I’m not a pro at these types of contract payments, but If the AIA has been approved as completed aren’t you done?
anything else is change order IMO.

 

[DrSparks]

Even if the reflectors were noted in the fixture schedule or notes, the fact that they arrived late, and after the work was done caused the EC to have to do rework. And we all know ceiling work is the most expensive. I'd say he's owed money for someone else's mistake.

Sent from my BE2028 using Tapatalk

 

[LarryFine]

Should I submit a change order for this?

I'm inclined to say a new proposal/contract.

 

[yordanys]

Were there submittals of these fixtures submitted to the EE from the GC?...If so, they should have copied you on them

I did not get any submittals of the lighting fixtures. Actually GC saw me doing the installation, they also received my daily report and I never hear anything regarding the lighting reflectors. I just very concern about GC holding payment if I don't install the reflector without a change order approval.

 

[yordanys]

If the reflectors were part of the base installation instructions, you may be out of luck. On the other hand, if they were an option and no one mentioned them, a change order would be justified.

I note you mention AIA. Jobs of this sort have a fair degree of formality. If the fixtures were supplied by others there should be an approved submittal which they should have given you a copy of. If the reflectors are noted/highlighted in the submittal, that might weaken your argument for a change order. On the other hand, if they aren't shown in the submittal, change order time it is.

GC is providing the Lighting fixtures, they told me to install them as soon as they got the lights to the facility, also GC and estimator stop by to see me installing the lights, I Sent them my daily report and never hear any comment or anything regarding the lighting reflectors. Can GC hold payment for this if I don't install the reflectors?

 

[yordanys]

What does the contract state?

GC is providing light, I did not get any Lighting submittal for the installation

 

[DrSparks]

GC is providing the Lighting fixtures, they told me to install them as soon as they got the lights to the facility, also GC and estimator stop by to see me installing the lights, I Sent them my daily report and never hear any comment or anything regarding the lighting reflectors. Can GC hold payment for this if I don't install the reflectors?

Well it boils down to this, the GC can withhold your payment until the dispute is settled. Your only legal remedy is in civil court. You have less leverage in this case than the GC because the work has been completed. Time to play hardball. There is also the property lien option, but should only be a last resort, and hopefully you haven't signed a lien waiver yet. Do you have an attorney?

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[cdslotz]

"Can GC hold payment for this if I don't install the reflectors?"

Not sure he can....but he will try

 

[gadfly56]

Well it boils down to this, the GC can withhold your payment until the dispute is settled. Your only legal remedy is in civil court. You have less leverage in this case than the GC because the work has been completed. Time to play hardball. There is also the property lien option, but should only be a last resort, and hopefully you haven't signed a lien waiver yet. Do you have an attorney?

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The lien should NOT be a last resort. You have limited time in which to file the lien. Depending on the state, it could be as little as 30 days or as long as 90 days from the last time you performed work on the site. If the contractor is trying to withhold payment, this is your only proximate remedy other than court. Due to the cycle times involved in AIA contracts, you could be near or even past the lien filing deadline before you find out the GC isn't going to pay. If the owner finds out there is a lien, he/she will be asking the GC some pointed questions.

 

[petersonra]

GC is providing the Lighting fixtures, they told me to install them as soon as they got the lights to the facility, also GC and estimator stop by to see me installing the lights, I Sent them my daily report and never hear any comment or anything regarding the lighting reflectors. Can GC hold payment for this if I don't install the reflectors?

Do you have the directive from the contractor telling you to install them in writing? I don't think what you wrote in your daily report matters a whole lot. The GC can do whatever he wants to if you don't install the reflectors for free. It seems to me that you need to have a chat with the guy and work out the problem. I'm not sure who is at fault here because you are telling us your side of the story and we don't know what other information might be important to know about the situation.

It seems to me if the general contractor sent you an email saying install these lights and now he wants you to uninstall them and install the reflectors and then reinstall the lights, then you have a very good argument for some kind of reimbursement for your added cost. However if the lights can't work without the reflector and you install them anyway it seems to me that you should never have installed them in the first place since you should have known that an integral part of the fixture was missing, and your argument for being paid to fix the problem is nowhere near as strong.

Really your best bet is a situation like this is to try and just work it out with the guy if you can. People want to go and get lawyers and file liens and all that kind of stuff when you might be able to resolve it just by having a friendly chat over a cup of coffee. That would be my first attempt anyway at resolving this issue.

But you also need to make sure that you're on solid ground that it's not your fault. From what you are telling us I can't tell who is at fault, or whether there is some kind of joint fault involved.

 

[oldsparky52]

It really boils down to whether you can afford to fight with the GC.

He thinks he's right, you think you're right. This is what courts are for.

In my experience, going past the GC and getting to the owner can be beneficial. It may be that both of you have some culpability.

So, if you like to fight for what's right, see you in court. If you don't want to go down that path, then IMO you should first fight for a change order (fight nicely), then settle for a compromise. Everyone is going to lose, either with doing unpaid work, paying more for work than you think you should have, or paying attorneys to battle this out, or or or.

How many lights are we talking about? Are they easily accessible? How much time are we talking about to install the reflectors? Are you having to rent equipment to access the lights?

It's not always about who's right or wrong, it's about getting paid.

I would try to talk to the owner and explain what happened and see what you can work out.