Steve Rupp
Member
I was looking at 210.8 and was wondering if a christmas outlet in the soffit would meet the exception to ground fault protection since the recepticle is not readily accessible. Or should I install a GFI breaker in the panel?
Christmas light outlets
- Thread starter Steve Rupp
- Start date
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allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: Christmas light outlets
I guess if there were enough lights on a string it could deice an area
I guess if there were enough lights on a string it could deice an area
JohnE
Senior Member
- Location
- Milford, MA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor, Inspector
Re: Christmas light outlets
A receptacle for Christmas lights will not fall under this exception. I believe that there once was an exception that would have applied, but has not been in nec for several cycles.
A receptacle for Christmas lights will not fall under this exception. I believe that there once was an exception that would have applied, but has not been in nec for several cycles.
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Christmas light outlets
They very much need a gfci.Either gfci receptacle or breaker.Depending on where the the gfci is might make it smarter to use a breaker.The real problem over installing outlets for x mas is you can plan on getting a call about it tripping.
They very much need a gfci.Either gfci receptacle or breaker.Depending on where the the gfci is might make it smarter to use a breaker.The real problem over installing outlets for x mas is you can plan on getting a call about it tripping.
Re: Christmas light outlets
Steve, if this "not readily accessible" outlet was in a garage it would not need GFCI protection, 210.8(A)(2)Exception No. 1, but since it is a soffit, 210.8(A)(3) says GFCI protection is required and the Exception to (3) doesn't give you any relief.
Roger
Steve, if this "not readily accessible" outlet was in a garage it would not need GFCI protection, 210.8(A)(2)Exception No. 1, but since it is a soffit, 210.8(A)(3) says GFCI protection is required and the Exception to (3) doesn't give you any relief.
Roger
Steve Rupp
Member
Re: Christmas light outlets
Thanks. It sounds like a dedicated circuit and a GFI breaker would be the best plan.
Thanks. It sounds like a dedicated circuit and a GFI breaker would be the best plan.
jwelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
Re: Christmas light outlets
Tell them to use candles and they will be no need for the receptacle or GFCI protection.
Tell them to use candles and they will be no need for the receptacle or GFCI protection.
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Christmas light outlets
"Tell them to use candles and they will be no need for the receptacle or GFCI protection."
You ever try to light 300 candles in the rain or snow And where do we buy UL listed candles?
"Tell them to use candles and they will be no need for the receptacle or GFCI protection."
You ever try to light 300 candles in the rain or snow
And where do we buy UL listed candles?Re: Christmas light outlets
Why not install a dedicated circuit without a GFCI breaker? Just install a GFCI receptacle as the first and daisy chain. Put the first GFCI in an accessable area so if it trips, it is easier to reset. Cheaper than a GFCI breaker. I would also install a switch for this circuit.
Why not install a dedicated circuit without a GFCI breaker? Just install a GFCI receptacle as the first and daisy chain. Put the first GFCI in an accessable area so if it trips, it is easier to reset. Cheaper than a GFCI breaker. I would also install a switch for this circuit.
mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
Re: Christmas light outlets
On new work, I've normally done a GFI rec next to the panel, that goes into a time clock, then out to the soffit rec(s). Like Rich000, I also have a hard time buying a GFCI breaker when space permits me to mount a GFCI rec in an accessible area.
On new work, I've normally done a GFI rec next to the panel, that goes into a time clock, then out to the soffit rec(s). Like Rich000, I also have a hard time buying a GFCI breaker when space permits me to mount a GFCI rec in an accessible area.
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Christmas light outlets
How much more could a GFCI breaker be than a GFCI receptacle?
The labor to install the breaker in the panel has to be less than the material & labor to mount and install the box, device and cover - making the proper splices??? or at least very close to the same price.
BTW: for anyone who may be concerned, the GFCI may sense enough leakage current from the conductors alone, if the length of run from the breaker to the outlet is long enough, causing nuisance tripping of the GFCI device.
How much more could a GFCI breaker be than a GFCI receptacle?
The labor to install the breaker in the panel has to be less than the material & labor to mount and install the box, device and cover - making the proper splices??? or at least very close to the same price.
BTW: for anyone who may be concerned, the GFCI may sense enough leakage current from the conductors alone, if the length of run from the breaker to the outlet is long enough, causing nuisance tripping of the GFCI device.
allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: Christmas light outlets
Pierre no matter how you look at it a device is $$$$$$$ side far cheaper than a gfci breaker.
Just look at new t pole panels there is a gfci device 125 v,and if there was a 50 amp gfci recep I bet that would be installed
Pierre no matter how you look at it a device is $$$$$$$ side far cheaper than a gfci breaker.
Just look at new t pole panels there is a gfci device 125 v,and if there was a 50 amp gfci recep I bet that would be installed
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: Christmas light outlets
Originally posted by allenwayne:
Just look at new t pole panels there is a gfci device 125 v,and if there was a 50 amp gfci recep I bet that would be installed
ty
Senior Member
- Location
- 3rd Rock from the Sun
Re: Christmas light outlets
I buy them buy the case, and they still cost twice that amount.
Where do you shop??
I buy them buy the case, and they still cost twice that amount.
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Christmas light outlets
Bob
take a look at 527.6(B)
Bob
take a look at 527.6(B)
allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: Christmas light outlets
Maybe the NEC doesn`t require a 50 amp gfci breaker but the local POCO`S will not hook up with out one.We probably have as a conservative # 1,250 T poles out there now with a 50 a gfci/tpole I just want what it cost to build them and I`ll go away(not for long though)
All joking aside it is ridiculous that we have to put a gfci breaker in an already built from the factory set up.Include the man hours and material including a 2p50 gfci there`s what
$225/ tpole multiply that by 1,250 and we have some big $$ tied up in stupid t poles.Some cost more to build than we make on the house but poco
says 1 tpole / house.Builder wants a tpole so they get finaled the meter is there the same reason the poco wants 1/ house.So here we sit with 1000`s + 1000`s of $$ sitting out there.
I just get a thrill when I see a sod crew throw an energized tpole off to the side so they can lay a piece of sod.
Maybe the NEC doesn`t require a 50 amp gfci breaker but the local POCO`S will not hook up with out one.We probably have as a conservative # 1,250 T poles out there now with a 50 a gfci/tpole I just want what it cost to build them and I`ll go away(not for long though)
All joking aside it is ridiculous that we have to put a gfci breaker in an already built from the factory set up.Include the man hours and material including a 2p50 gfci there`s what
$225/ tpole multiply that by 1,250 and we have some big $$ tied up in stupid t poles.Some cost more to build than we make on the house but poco
says 1 tpole / house.Builder wants a tpole so they get finaled the meter is there the same reason the poco wants 1/ house.So here we sit with 1000`s + 1000`s of $$ sitting out there.
I just get a thrill when I see a sod crew throw an energized tpole off to the side so they can lay a piece of sod.
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Christmas light outlets
Often we see 2 or 3 t poles next to each other all from same company.Gone are the days when i could get at least 4 houses from 1 pole.That is untill its to there own advantage.Perhaps they want the dollars from the hook up and customer charges.
Often we see 2 or 3 t poles next to each other all from same company.Gone are the days when i could get at least 4 houses from 1 pole.That is untill its to there own advantage.Perhaps they want the dollars from the hook up and customer charges.
allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: Christmas light outlets
No Jim it`s just easier on the poco there already is a meter sitting there when released they make sure the main is off set the meter and run like hell before anyone turns it on
No Jim it`s just easier on the poco there already is a meter sitting there when released they make sure the main is off set the meter and run like hell before anyone turns it on
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