Combining 12/2 and 14/2

[jharlow22]

Just failed an inspection during a remodel. We picked up a 12/2 20 amp homerun and branched off for new outlets (15 amp) for rough in with 14/2. Never been a problem before.

 

[augie47]

Seemingly you have dodged the bullet previously. Definitely a NEC violation !

(Please note what type "contractor" in your profile.. 'General',, "Electrical',etc))

 

[infinity]

Yes that is not code compliant.

 

[LarryFine]

Welcome to the forum.

Just failed an inspection during a remodel.

The failure was correct. The wire size must be maintained for the entire circuit, regardless of expected load.

 

[roger]

Just failed an inspection during a remodel. We picked up a 12/2 20 amp homerun and branched off for new outlets (15 amp) for rough in with 14/2. Never been a problem before.

I would say the inspector didn't actually look at the whole circuit.

Roger

 

[hillbilly1]

Just failed an inspection during a remodel. We picked up a 12/2 20 amp homerun and branched off for new outlets (15 amp) for rough in with 14/2. Never been a problem before.

At one time long ago, it was allowed for switch legs only. You can change the breaker to 15 amps though, and be back legal. (Unless it feeds an area that requires 20 amp). Inspector was on his game, and correct.

 

[hillbilly1]

Welcome to the forum.


The failure was correct. The wire size must be maintained for the entire circuit, regardless of expected load.

Actually it doesn’t, it just needs to have the ampacity above the rating of the ocp.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

At one time long ago, it was allowed for switch legs only. You can change the breaker to 15 amps though, and be back legal. (Unless it feeds an area that requires 20 amp). Inspector was on his game, and correct.

While a common practice in some areas, I don't think that the NEC ever permitted 14 AWG switch loops on a 20 amp circuit.

 

[qcroanoke]

Actually it doesn’t, it just needs to have the ampacity equal to or above the rating of the ocp.

 

[LarryFine]

Actually it doesn’t, it just needs to have the ampacity above the rating of the ocp.

Right. I meant for the 20a circuit in question.

 

[Tulsa Electrician]

Hard to believe however I have seen it and seen it get passed. This was in northwest Arkansas.
Here is the jist of it. A 20 branch circuit used for lighting no recpt allowed. #12 nmb home run and between all switch boxes( hot in and hot out). Then as they called it a lighting tap. There words not mine or NEC. You could use 14-3 for three ways and switch legs as long as the load served was not over 7 amps. The inspector would count each lighting outlet at 180va. The exception was recessed cans were rated at the max wattage listed on can and allowed quantity not to exceed 7amps per run based on Max watt rating or you had to use #12 switch leg.
This being the same AHJ that did not allow bonding of the water line. He said this kills plumbers. The AHJ in this case was an fire inspector.
Things have changed in northwest Arkansas for the better thank goodness.


You will notice I said NMB. That will give you an idea of the year to current.

 

[hillbilly1]

While a common practice in some areas, I don't think that the NEC ever permitted 14 AWG switch loops on a 20 amp circuit.

For some reason it sticks in my mind when I was at trade school. Maybe 78’ nec edition? I never liked it, and never did it, but seems like later I heard it was changed due to remodels where they changed the switches to receptacles?

 

[acin]

For some reason it sticks in my mind when I was at trade school. Maybe 78’ nec edition? I never liked it, and never did it, but seems like later I heard it was changed due to remodels where they changed the switches to receptacles?

if the 14 was on a ocpd would it be a tap?

 

[readydave8]

For some reason it sticks in my mind when I was at trade school. Maybe 78’ nec edition? I never liked it, and never did it, but seems like later I heard it was changed due to remodels where they changed the switches to receptacles?

Like Don, I constantly saw it done, but never saw it legal in codebook (started in late 70's)

Some guys would say tap rules, but requirements never matched

 

[petersonra]

Welcome to the forum.


The failure was correct. The wire size must be maintained for the entire circuit, regardless of expected load.

That is not true, as long as all the conductor sizes are protected by the OCPD.

 

[LarryFine]

That is not true, as long as all the conductor sizes are protected by the OCPD.

Right. Addressed in post #10.