Combining 2 services into 1?...

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sw_ross

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Talking about a house and a detached garage on same property...
The meter is on a pole at the property boundary.
Set of service conductors go to house, 200-amp panel,
Another set goes to garage, 100-amp panel.

GC is basically building an addition that joins the 2 structures, thereby making 1 structure that is fed by 2 services, which obviously not code compliant.

I don't think this scenario is completely unique, I've seen at least 1 other place like that in my area.

How would, or did, you deal with a situation like this?

In this situation the addition includes a new dining room area, entry/mudrom, etc. all of which will be easier to feed out of garage panel since house panel is in finished basement on the other side of the house.
 
LarryFine said:
I suggest checking with both the POCO and the permit/inspection people.
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I thought about making the service located out at the meter and the existing panels (house and garage) sub panels but that would require trenching in the 4th wire (EGC) and separating grounds and neutrals in both panel...
Not an easy option.
I'll call AHJ on Monday.

Why would the poco care what happens after the meter?
 
sw_ross said:
I thought about making the service located out at the meter and the existing panels (house and garage) sub panels but that would require trenching in the 4th wire (EGC) and separating grounds and neutrals in both panel...
Not an easy option.
I'll call AHJ on Monday.
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Thought about that also but then you would have two feeders to one structure, a violation of 225.30
I think they are going to have to accept the fact that part of the project is going to entail a (ONE)new service
 
augie47 said:
Thought about that also but then you would have two feeders to one structure, a violation of 225.30
I think they are going to have to accept the fact that part of the project is going to entail a (ONE)new service
Click to expand...

So you're saying a new service to the (now) "single" structure (used to be 2 structures), attached to the structure, that then feeds 2 sub panels (house and garage)?

I see what you're saying from 225.30(A)- More than one feeder to a structure not allowed.

This is more involved than I was hoping. Good thing it's not a bid job!
I'll definitely be calling the AHJ Monday.
 
For the record, I dont see the original scenario as two services, rather it falls under 230.40 exception #3. But, still an issue with the two structures becoming one. Tough situation, no easy solution. Maybe you will get lucky and the AHJ will give you a pass on two feeders.
 
I know there is a place in the code (which I don't care to find) which says you can add a ground wire to a receptacle which is external to the other wiring. In other words, it can follow an entirely different route. Perhaps this applies to subpanels as well. If so, you can run a ground wire from the house panel to the garage panel through the structure, not underground. Then you can convert the garage panel to a sub and delete the unneeded feeder.
 
Coppersmith said:
I know there is a place in the code (which I don't care to find) which says you can add a ground wire to a receptacle which is external to the other wiring. In other words, it can follow an entirely different route. Perhaps this applies to subpanels as well. If so, you can run a ground wire from the house panel to the garage panel through the structure, not underground. Then you can convert the garage panel to a sub and delete the unneeded feeder.
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I think you referenceing 250.130(C) which i unique to grounding receptacles.
For a feeder, I believe 300.3(B) would require all conductors of the same circuit to be in the same raceway,.
 
I've been thinking about this setup over the weekend.
Going to call the AHJ today.

In preparation for the phone call, depending on where the conversation goes, I'm thinking of a couple of solutions.
Currently, the 3-conductor cable from the meter to the house I'm assuming is 4/0 Al, although I'll need to verify the size.

Option #1- Basically convert both panels into sub-panels by using the 3-conductor wire from the meter and mounting a 200-amp and a 100-amp service discos side-by side on house.

Option #2- Still convert both panels to sub-panels, but using a 200-amp service disco mounted on the house that has a couple of extra spaces in the panel, then using a 100-amp breaker to feed the garage panel.

The 2 options aren't significantly different. The deciding factor would be whether the 4/0 service wire can be tapped to feed the 2 separate vehicles or not, and if there are any benefits from doing so.

Question- Can the 4/0 service wire be tapped to feed 2 service discos, 1-200 amp and 1-100 amp?
 
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