Commerical water tank ( Wye Connection)

Status
Not open for further replies.
To answer to Bob question

I got 6 elements ( 3 on the upper part of the tank and 3 on the lower part of the tank ) each elements is 6 000Watts.

The total is 18 000 + 18 000 = 36 000 Watts.

To answer to Rick questions :

'' suspect he is measuring the line current leading to the delta, not the phase current going through the delta. "

There's no phase point in delta configuration ( triangle)
Only in Wye


Now im wondering if the mfg did not had any mix batch
They give me a 15 000W element instead ?!?! :confused:

Vito R.
Master Electrician
Axxus Electric
 
I do remember reading Ohms on one of the element
It give me about 20 Ohms.

So those element were rated to be install on a 347 Volts ( Wye Configuration
even if it said 600V on the plate)



E ( sqare two) / R = 6000Watts

My question can it be done this way ( wye) without the neutral reference point ? I never done this !

and im curious If it can be done how can it give a 347 Volts if there's no reference point Neutral connect to ground ?

Like the diagram in this threah ?


Regards
 
Last edited:
Axxus said:
My question can it be done this way ( wye) without the neutral reference point ? I never done this !
Click to expand...
Yes, as I said in my original posting, you do not need a neutral wire, the elements will create one by themselves. As long as all three elements are close to being the same size, the neutral point will be the same as though you actually had a neutral wire.

If all three elements were identical, even if you did have a neutral wire, there would be no current flowing in it, and that is why this works.
 
Axxus said:
To answer to Bob question
I got 6 elements ( 3 on the upper part of the tank and 3 on the lower part of the tank ) each elements is 6 000Watts.
The total is 18 000 + 18 000 = 36 000 Watts.
Click to expand...

Watts = E x I per phase in a delta.
6000 = 600 x I
I = 10 amps per phase
Line I = 1.73 x 10 = 17.3 amps.
Sounds like the elements are rated for 600 volts.
If this is correct, the resistance of the heater is 600 volts/10 amps = 60 ohms
Wattage is IxIxR = 10x10x60 = 6000 watts.

To answer to Rick questions :
'' suspect he is measuring the line current leading to the delta, not the phase current going through the delta. "
There's no phase point in delta configuration ( triangle)
Only in Wye
Click to expand...
Not true. The phase current is the current flowing in each heater when
connected delta. Line current is 1.73 x 10 = 17.3 amps.

Now im wondering if the mfg did not had any mix batch
They give me a 15 000W element instead ?!?! :confused:
Click to expand...

I certainly agree. Suggest you get it right. You need an element rated for
350 volts and not 600 volts. If you use the 60 ohm elements at 350 volts
then I = 350/60 = 5.8 amps.
watts = 5.8 x 5.8 x 60 = 2018 watts. Only 1/3 the original output.
 
You right Rick

This morning I went back to the site
I connect the Element at the Wye Configuration like we discuss this wee-end.

Bingo !!

All the reading was accurate

So each element give me 15 Amps

Element are made too be connect to Wye Configuraton even if it said 600Volts

E (square) / R = (347 *347 / 20 Ohms ) = 6000 Watts +/-


In conclusion , Never stop finding solution to your problems and keep your heads up

Regards,

Anyway Thanks to all to clarify this
 
winnie said:
Oh, the resistance certainly does change. But with a water heater the element might go from 280K cold to 350K hot, whereas in the light bulb you might go from 290K cold to 2900K hot. In both cases the temperature will change and the resistance will change, but the resistance change in the light bulb is much larger than that of the water heater element.

For the purpose of the present discussion, I believe that you can ignore the resistance change of the heater element. But the resistance change in the light bulb is so large that it cannot be ignored.

-Jon
Click to expand...

You CAN'T ignore it. The wattage rating will be different and non-linear.
 
Re: temperature change of resistance on a water heater element

weressl said:
You CAN'T ignore it. The wattage rating will be different and non-linear.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, but I believe that the resistance of a water heater element will be constant enough that it can be treated as constant for the purposes of the present discussion.

If we presume that the resistance element is nichrome, and that the temperature changes by 100C (in other words, ice water to boiling water), then we get a resistance change of 4%.

That is probably smaller than the tolerance with which the heating element is manufactured. It certainly is smaller than the allowable voltage variation.

-Jon
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top