Compact fluorescents and continuity

[chris kennedy]

you can then pull the grounded conductors and isolate which panel

Again, from the installers point of view, I'm not going to pull 4,6,8 large neutrals that have already been torqued out of MDP to find a problem. I will pull 20 small conductors out of 4 to 8 panels quicker. Work from the outside in.

 

[benaround]

I'll bet you have continuity through the exit or emg fixtures.

 

[chris kennedy]

I'll bet you have continuity through the exit or emg fixtures.

I got that from your earlier post. Ran out of time today but will be checking with multiple meters and will let you know.

 

[winnie]

I leave the panel with A,B,C and one neutral. During a neutral fault test, I find continuity between the neutral and EGC. So we pull the neutrals off the buss

Could you describe the method and meter you used for the test?

I would assume that you lift the neutral and then check for continuity between neutral and ground, however you describe doing the test and _then_ pulling the neutrals off the bus.

-Jon

 

[ohm]

Chris, when you pulled the grounded conductors off the neutral bar in the sub-panels did the lights try to come on come on as you energized each branch circuit ONE by ONE.

I've used this method successfully to find ground wires touching neutrals.

 

[cadpoint]

Could you describe the method and meter you used for the test?

I would assume that you lift the neutral and then check for continuity between neutral and ground, however you describe doing the test and _then_ pulling the neutrals off the bus.

-Jon

yeah what he said! Only cause I put it to the search engine test...

Frankly, I first thought the color blind electrician, got in there! But my second thought was how could you be finding this with dead batteries ?

Where's the half way rule, go half way down a circuit and then back of equal distance again depending on the reading.

I kinda like the thought about a summary from the loads but ruled that out because its a lighting load. Gezz maybe I'll have to check and lift myself!

Check the batteries in the fluke 1507, and you won't have to do 2X the lifting!

 

[chris kennedy]

Could you describe the method and meter you used for the test?

From the top:

1) Open all branch circuit breakers in the panel

2) Pull all branch circuit grounded conductors off the buss

3) Test branch circuit grounded conductors for continuity to EGC

4) Lets say suspect neutral is labeled 2,4,6. Cap neutral and turn on 2. Check for current on the branch circuit EGC. None found, lights still off. Turn 2 off and 4 on, same results, repeat for 6.

5) Scratch head, post very confusing thread.

Meter used was an Ideal DMM 61-774, battery suspect.

 

[winnie]

Chris,

At step 3, did you touch the probes to the wire, get the continuity beep, and release? Or did you hold the probes in place for a period of time and have the continuity beep for the entire time?

When you measured a single uninstalled fixture, did you set the meter to its various resistance ranges and get a resistance value between fixture neutral and ground?

-Jon

 

[ohm]

Chris, I too have an Ideal DMM and if the battery is getting weak all bets are off, it really goes crazy.

Also, remember there are multiple paths for fault current to return to a panel other than the bare wire. All the building steel is an EGC, per Code.

You really should switch to a megger, a nine volt test won't find leakage current in a mile of wire and you need to assign numbers to your findings.

I admire your tenacity, some would call it a wrap, since everything works...for now.

 

[chris kennedy]

We have a winner!

We have a winner!

Chris, I too have an Ideal DMM and if the battery is getting weak all bets are off, it really goes crazy.

Today went back in with new batteries in the Ideal and Greenlee CM-850, which is my DMM of choice, but the battery was weak in that when we started the first test. Also used the Fluke T+. No neutral faults where found.

At step 3, did you touch the probes to the wire, get the continuity beep, and release? Or did you hold the probes in place for a period of time and have the continuity beep for the entire time?

This was a mistake on my part Jon. I don't just flash the probe to the conductor, I hold it there. The Ideal was kind of spurting and sputtering with the beeps, but with a meter not often used, I was just thinking poor contact due to dirty leads.

I thank you all and hope I didn't waste too much of any ones time. I will try to be more thorough before I get my friends chasing my ghosts. At least I learned something from this.

 

[ohm]

Today went back in with new batteries in the Ideal and Greenlee CM-850, which is my DMM of choice, but the battery was weak in that when we started the first test. Also used the Fluke T+. No neutral faults where found.



This was a mistake on my part Jon. I don't just flash the probe to the conductor, I hold it there. The Ideal was kind of spurting and sputtering with the beeps, but with a meter not often used, I was just thinking poor contact due to dirty leads.

I thank you all and hope I didn't waste too much of any ones time. I will try to be more thorough before I get my friends chasing my ghosts. At least I learned something from this.

Great Chris, glad you found it, we all learn from these exercises.

 

[chris kennedy]

Great Chris, glad you found it, we all learn from these exercises.

You won a weeks stay in one of the guest room here. Please book that while I'm away, there is only one computer.