CONDUITS IN SLAB

[Alwayslearningelec]

Curious.....If you were estimating a job and you had a floor with A LOT of panels and feeders on that floor what would determine(besides spec) whether you would try to run/estimate them in the deck? I would imagine depth of slab is one. THanks.

 

[infinity]

Some times it pays to run stuff in the deck before the pour and sometimes it doesn't. One factor could be the cost difference between different types of raceways such as using RMC (before) or EMT (after). More importantly is how good are your installers at deck work and how good are your engineers and layout guys. Chopping out conduits later that are installed wrong or in the wrong location is a real money loser. :roll:

 

[fridaymean]

We will always lay conduit in/under the slab when able / applicable. It is much less labor than running EMT overhead. (Use PVC if possible in/under the slab)

 

[Fulthrotl]

Curious.....If you were estimating a job and you had a floor with A LOT of panels and feeders on that floor what would determine(besides spec) whether you would try to run/estimate them in the deck? I would imagine depth of slab is one. THanks.

run everything in the slab you can.

everything.

the more i put in the slab, the more i make.
if your guys can't hit a wall tho, you are screwed.

use smurf, everywhere you can, turn up in yard ells,
with couplings and plugs on the ends, not taped.
have a shop muppet make them up, ridgid coupling
with a pipe plug on long end, FA on bottom end, and
3m corrosion tape wrapped.

my best day doing that was on the waterfront hilton,
got 1,000' per hour for 12 hours.

went home blurry eyed... we had one day to put in the
whole deck before pouring.

 

[Cow]

I've never used smurf, only pvc. So what's the skinny on this stuff? Are you guys using it only on decks or slab on grade too? How's it pull through? Are you using it on big feeders or just little stuff?

When do you pick smurf over pvc?

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

run everything in the slab you can.

everything.

the more i put in the slab, the more i make.
if your guys can't hit a wall tho, you are screwed.

use smurf, everywhere you can, turn up in yard ells,
with couplings and plugs on the ends, not taped.
have a shop muppet make them up, ridgid coupling
with a pipe plug on long end, FA on bottom end, and
3m corrosion tape wrapped.

my best day doing that was on the waterfront hilton,
got 1,000' per hour for 12 hours.

went home blurry eyed... we had one day to put in the
whole deck before pouring.

What size conduit??? EMT or RGS

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

I've never used smurf, only pvc. So what's the skinny on this stuff? Are you guys using it only on decks or slab on grade too? How's it pull through? Are you using it on big feeders or just little stuff?

When do you pick smurf over pvc?

Is this Smurf tube???? I have heard of it before? What exactly is it's application? Thanks.

 

[Fulthrotl]

I've never used smurf, only pvc. So what's the skinny on this stuff? Are you guys using it only on decks or slab on grade too? How's it pull through? Are you using it on big feeders or just little stuff?

When do you pick smurf over pvc?

decks mostly... i've used it on grade, but it's a post tension slab slam dunk

it requires under half the pulling force.. the wire just glides on the ribs.
you can also blow jet line thru it a lot farther than schedule 40

i don't run it above 1", but it's fast to do.

they make a nice lightweight cutter for it, but you can also use a
razor knife, and score in one of the ribs half way around, and just snap it.

they have snap couplings, FA and MA connectors, but they are a bit pricy,
so i just glue it with regular pvc couplings.. water tighter that way, and cheaper

it's crazy nuts fast to run with snap couplings tho, and they don't come apart.

you have a belt and a nail bag full of couplings, and a snipper tool, and you just
scream... use cheap tye raps for strapping.

that 1000' an hour day, i was just getting lifts dropped, cutting them open and
pushing everything towards the main switch gear room, on the 4th floor.... the
foreman was laying out the deck, the muppet was wiring up yard ells or red dots,
so it was just put the stuff in as fast as you could.... but it came out to a 100'
bundle in the deck every five minutes.... there were spots there was more smurf
than concrete.

and best of all, it's blue. how can you not like blue conduit?

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

So could you get 2 or 3" conduits in a deck? What other factors would you consider? If a scenario was that you had 20- 2" feeders on a floor what would determine whether or not you put it in the deck besides cost from EMT to RGS? Thanks

 

[Strathead]

Other advantages to the slab I haven't even heard mentioned. To the ceiling is often 6 feet up and 6 feet back down. In slab is usually 3 feet up 3 feet down. In slab is straight shot, no bends, no straps to speak of other than to prevent floating, above ceiling is often 25 to 50 percent longer and if copper is involved that is a lot of money. Something else not mentioned here is MC rated for concrete contact. A little pricey, but super laber saver.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

Other advantages to the slab I haven't even heard mentioned. To the ceiling is often 6 feet up and 6 feet back down. In slab is usually 3 feet up 3 feet down. In slab is straight shot, no bends, no straps to speak of other than to prevent floating, above ceiling is often 25 to 50 percent longer and if copper is involved that is a lot of money. Something else not mentioned here is MC rated for concrete contact. A little pricey, but super laber saver.

Yes, but what would determine if you could run everthing in the slab? Is ti even know at bid time or you have yo wait until your in field.

 

[cdslotz]

So could you get 2 or 3" conduits in a deck? What other factors would you consider? If a scenario was that you had 20- 2" feeders on a floor what would determine whether or not you put it in the deck besides cost from EMT to RGS? Thanks

I know you said what other than the specs determine, but the specs have EVERYTHING to do with determining what to do.
Typical specs around here don't allow anything larger than 1" in the pour. Some specs would require those to be in RGS. Running larger conduits like 2" would be a structural issue.
Most specs around here don't allow smurf tube at all.

What do the specs say about all of this? If there are no specs, I wouldn't consider anything as large a 2".

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

I know you said what other than the specs determine, but the specs have EVERYTHING to do with determining what to do.
Typical specs around here don't allow anything larger than 1" in the pour. Some specs would require those to be in RGS. Running larger conduits like 2" would be a structural issue.
Most specs around here don't allow smurf tube at all.

What do the specs say about all of this? If there are no specs, I wouldn't consider anything as large a 2".

Will find out, thanks

 

[Cow]

Anybody used pvc coated MC in slabs yet? That stuff looks crazy fast for installing!!! I'd hate to have a factory defect shorted in the concrete though:blink:

http://www.southwire.com/commercial/mega-mc-cable-photo-gallery.htm

decks mostly... i've used it on grade, but it's a post tension slab slam dunk

it requires under half the pulling force.. the wire just glides on the ribs.
you can also blow jet line thru it a lot farther than schedule 40

i don't run it above 1", but it's fast to do.

they make a nice lightweight cutter for it, but you can also use a
razor knife, and score in one of the ribs half way around, and just snap it.

they have snap couplings, FA and MA connectors, but they are a bit pricy,
so i just glue it with regular pvc couplings.. water tighter that way, and cheaper

it's crazy nuts fast to run with snap couplings tho, and they don't come apart.

you have a belt and a nail bag full of couplings, and a snipper tool, and you just
scream... use cheap tye raps for strapping.

that 1000' an hour day, i was just getting lifts dropped, cutting them open and
pushing everything towards the main switch gear room, on the 4th floor.... the
foreman was laying out the deck, the muppet was wiring up yard ells or red dots,
so it was just put the stuff in as fast as you could.... but it came out to a 100'
bundle in the deck every five minutes.... there were spots there was more smurf
than concrete.

and best of all, it's blue. how can you not like blue conduit?

I wanna try it now!!!

 

[Fulthrotl]

Anybody used pvc coated MC in slabs yet? That stuff looks crazy fast for installing!!! I'd hate to have a factory defect shorted in the concrete though:blink:

http://www.southwire.com/commercial/mega-mc-cable-photo-gallery.htm

I wanna try it now!!!

i used large mc once, in a data center.

a level 5 rocket scientist decided that 4C. 500MCM would be a good idea under a
computer floor. so they brought out a roll of it.

spool was 8' dia and 4' wide. utility style wemco.

then, the GF decided that a bucket brigade process was the way to install it.
so they got seven guys to muscle it in, including yours truly.

it works much better, if you put a pull rope in, and have a single guy on the
nose of it, keeping it from snagging on stuff, and one guy on the reel and one
on the tugger... just snoodle it in nice and easy.... instead this was the foreman
screaming "PULL", like a rowing cadence, while seven monkeys attempted
congress with the same football simultaneously.

trust me, you don't want to have anything to do with this stuff. honest.

 

[Cow]

i used large mc once, in a data center.

a level 5 rocket scientist decided that 4C. 500MCM would be a good idea under a
computer floor. so they brought out a roll of it.

spool was 8' dia and 4' wide. utility style wemco.

then, the GF decided that a bucket brigade process was the way to install it.
so they got seven guys to muscle it in, including yours truly.

it works much better, if you put a pull rope in, and have a single guy on the
nose of it, keeping it from snagging on stuff, and one guy on the reel and one
on the tugger... just snoodle it in nice and easy.... instead this was the foreman
screaming "PULL", like a rowing cadence, while seven monkeys attempted
congress with the same football simultaneously.

trust me, you don't want to have anything to do with this stuff. honest.

I believe you!