Hi Guys - I need some help. I've been asked to convert some old barracks into individual dwelling units for Homeless Veterans. The new units will have sleeping, living, cooking, and bathing so I feel fairly confidant that this qualifies as dwelling units. The rooms are small - 18' x 13', but they have a small bar with electric cooking and a full bath. The service for the entire building is 1200 amps 3 phase. It is a 3 story building. We are putting in 40 individual units on 2 separate floors. My question is about disconnects and feeders: Does each unit need a load center with a disconnect?
Converting Barracks into Apartments
- Thread starter clarice
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e57
Senior Member
- Location
- San Francisco, CA
Depends on who's paying the bills really - as collectively are they tenants - or individually? Access is one thing for individual tenants and another for groups of them IMO.clarice said:
- Location
- Massachusetts
I agree with Mark.
Here If it is more like an apartment building each unit would get a load center. If it is more like a hotel then groups of centrally located panelboards are used.
Here If it is more like an apartment building each unit would get a load center. If it is more like a hotel then groups of centrally located panelboards are used.
Minuteman
Senior Member
- Location
- The Sooner Nation
Newer Military base housing will often have individual services that have a meter link installed rather than a meter. They CT the service feeders and bill the government, but if later the homes are sold to the public, there will be individual services already in place.
The 2006 International Energy Conservation Code (if it's in effect in your area) requires dwelling units to be individually metered.
Here in Illinois, I would have no choice other than meter each unit.
http://www.energycodes.gov/implement/state_codes/index.stm
Here in Illinois, I would have no choice other than meter each unit.
http://www.energycodes.gov/implement/state_codes/index.stm
E-57 Has a good point
E-57 Has a good point
Thanks for quoting 225.35. I checked with the management and it does appear that there is a staff member on site at all times. The apartments are monthly rentals - the idea is to get veterans off the street and into housing. This complex is a bit frightening - electrically speaking (wires dangling....nothing marked) - so it is difficult to know where to start. It was Federal Military, but it is being turned over to the State and the non-profit Veterans group. I'm thinking now that I can feed each individual room from the main panel on the floor. My thought is that this feed has to be a double pole 60 amps in a separate conduit. Since there are going to be 30 units on a floor - that is a lot of breakers! I suppose I should alternate phases - AB/BC/CA.....I'm thinking that the feeds should be in individual conduits running to the load center in each room. Since money is so tight is seems like eliminating the main breaker in the load center is acceptable. I don't really like this though. The point about AFCI is good too....I guess this is basically like a tiny house. Do I need two small appliance circuits in a 5' kitchen?
E-57 Has a good point
Thanks for quoting 225.35. I checked with the management and it does appear that there is a staff member on site at all times. The apartments are monthly rentals - the idea is to get veterans off the street and into housing. This complex is a bit frightening - electrically speaking (wires dangling....nothing marked) - so it is difficult to know where to start. It was Federal Military, but it is being turned over to the State and the non-profit Veterans group. I'm thinking now that I can feed each individual room from the main panel on the floor. My thought is that this feed has to be a double pole 60 amps in a separate conduit. Since there are going to be 30 units on a floor - that is a lot of breakers! I suppose I should alternate phases - AB/BC/CA.....I'm thinking that the feeds should be in individual conduits running to the load center in each room. Since money is so tight is seems like eliminating the main breaker in the load center is acceptable. I don't really like this though. The point about AFCI is good too....I guess this is basically like a tiny house. Do I need two small appliance circuits in a 5' kitchen?
- Location
- Massachusetts
steve66 said:
Steve I am sure that does not apply to an occupancy that is smilier to a hotel.
iwire said:
First, let me clairify, the metering for each dwelling unit doesn't have to be a utility meter - it can be some type of submeter.
My first thought was of course you don't have to meter hotels rooms even if they have a cooktop or cooking provisions. (I have even recently approved plans for a hotel that had a cooktop in each room. And everything was on one meter).
I thought my mistake might be assuming that the Energy Code definition of a dwelling unit was the same as the NEC definition of a dwelling unit.
So I looked in the IECC, and the definition is word for word the same as the NEC, except the IECC includes "provisions for eating" in their definition. (Which I think makes no difference at all).
I'm sure you are right, Iwire, the intent wasn't to meter every hotel room even if it has cooking provisions. But that doesn't seem to be how the code reads, and I think an inspector would be within his right to require this.
I think it just shows how carzy the energy code is.
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