counting recessed lighting in branch circuits

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Timewatcher384

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I'm an residential leadman having a boss telling me to count each recessed lighting as one and another licensed employee telling me you can count up to four cans as one in circuit I cannot find anything in codes except for 3va per foot for house calculations. Who is right
 
220.3(B)(4) Recessed Luminaires (Lighting Fixtures) An outlet supplying recessed luminaire(s) shall be computed based on the maximum volt-ampre rating of the equipment and lamps for which the luminaire(s) [fixture(s)] is rated.
 
Time,

Your post is rather vague. I think that the others have probably answered your question. Could you provide some more information?
 
counting recessed number 2

counting recessed number 2

:cool: I understand more to the extint of counting watts to my breaker size for cans. To make it planner I combine outlets and lights in with my 15 amp 14-2 branch circuits if I have 8 recepticles in a master bedroom and 4 recessed lights. That would put my circuit at 12. If i count recepticles and canned lighting at one each. Usually I keep and combined total of 10 outlets and lights to a 15 amp circuit. Am I counting my branch circuits correct. If recepticles count as 180va X 10= 1800 watts or do I need to count lighting seperate from plugs which puts a damper on saving wire in some cases
 
Okay, I get it. You're talking about a rule of thumb to use when laying out circuits.

Timewatcher384 said:
Usually I keep and combined total of 10 outlets and lights to a 15 amp circuit. Am I counting my branch circuits correct.
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That's kind of a judgement call on your part. People have their own rules of thumb for this sort of thing. Some guys will catch all bedroom lighting on a circuit, and then deal with the outlets on a seperate circuit to keep appliances like vacuums from dimming the lights.

Mine is basically the same as yours - I keep around ten holes a circuit. But I count cans as being half a hole, since they generally max out at 75W and the ten holes idea is based loosely around the 180W per receptacle idea.

Essentially, there is no code for residential, you can place as many receptacles on a circuit as you'd like. Good design leads you to the ten holes per circuit idea. I found, as I got into bigger houses, that I'd tend to divvy up lighting and receptacles more, to stretch my lighting circuits farther.

Small houses I tended to mix them and just make small zones. Master Bed L&R, Bed 2&3 L&R, General Lighting, Kitchen Lighting, Living Receps, Utility L, and then the required 20A circuits.
 
The simple answer for residential dwellings as George said is that there is no set rule for number of receptacles on a circuit. If you calculate at 3va/sq ft you will find the number of required circuits. It's up to you to decide how to use them.
 
georgestolz said:
Mine is basically the same as yours - I keep around ten holes a circuit. But I count cans as being half a hole, since they generally max out at 75W and the ten holes idea is based loosely around the 180W per receptacle idea.
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George, I know you know this... but you can't just assume the recess max. is 75w, I use Juno and most of those max out at 150w... that is a HUGE difference... that only allows me 12 fixtures on a 15amp circuit...
 
George, let me pick your brain, Lets say we install 12 recess lights rated at 150w max, how many receptacles do you feel comfortable with on that same circuit? I'm only asking because I feel your a smart guy, I feel the NEC is lacking something here... I'm talking residential only...
 
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I'd probably call it good there, but I've never installed cans with that max rating.

I wouldn't install any receptacles with those cans myself.

And I think the term you were looking for is smart aleck. :)
 
If we're talking continuous load here, which lighting certainly could be, wouldn't we be limited to 9 cans at (9 x 150) 1350 watts? 10 x 150 would exceed 80% (120 x 15 = 1800), or 1440 watts.

Plus, we can't exceed 50% of that if we want any receptacles on the circuit.
 
Burn your eyes out,, say I

Burn your eyes out,, say I

I have only seen 150watt on a single can, (one lighting up the stairway to a basement etc. ) I have never seen 150watt used on a string of cans,, in residential,,, (just an FYI)
 
edamico11 said:
I have only seen 150watt on a single can, (one lighting up the stairway to a basement etc. ) I have never seen 150watt used on a string of cans,, in residential,,, (just an FYI)
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That may be true, but I have used quite a few 150-watt and even larger reflectors in 8" cans in tall ceilings.

The point is, however, that the can's maximum rating as installed (trim/baffle choice, etc.) must be used, not the installed bulb alone, to avoid overloading the circuit.

If someone else replaces a bulb with one larger than the one you installed, but still within the allowable limit, it would be your responsibility if they experience tripping*.




*No, not that kind! :cool:
 
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LarryFine

LarryFine

In responce to your post:


"...The point is, however, that the can's maximum rating as installed (trim/baffle choice, etc.) must be used, not the installed bulb alone, to avoid overloading the circuit"...



I can only conclude that ,, you are correct:wink: I should never assume future events..
 
georgestolz said:
Code reference, please, Larry? :)
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You're absolutely correct. Luminaires are excepted from that provision.

As Anna Rosannadanna used to say, "Never mind!"
 
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