Customer wants me to commit fraud

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electricmanscott

electricmanscott

Senior Member
Location
Boston, MA
Going in to finish up a small $1500.00 project I informed the customer I would need a check when I finish. Ok no problem.

She calls back and tells me to make the check out to her husbands business and write "Wired outlets and lighting in warehouse...." and list labor and materials

This was NOT the job that I did. I wired a couple of receptacles and undercabinet lights in their family room at their house.


I brought the bill stating exactly what I did. The husband was taken aback when I gave it to him.

"Didn't you get my message??" he asks. I said yes (not his message anyway, his wife was doing his dirty work) I am not doing that I tell him. Shocked he asks why? "Because I didn't do the work you want me to bill you for, I am billing you for the work that I actually did in your house not your business...."

Mercedes, Chevy Tahoe, Ford dually pickup, huge boat, pool, suana, hot tub etc.... :rolleyes:

The wife works as a waitress. Oh sure not too much going on under the radar with these people.
 
Remind him that Leona Helmsley did the same thing and ended up in jail. He should have at least given you the option upfront to break the law.
 
The problem is as you said the work was done at their home, and your insurance if it is continued operations, and error and ommisions type and not the hacker year to year min $800 policies, you are risking everything, by false filing the job, was there a permit filed?
 
You can probably meet in the middle someplace.

You can make the bill out to anyone at all, so just make it out to the business if that's what they want. This is a pretty normal thing. Mothers and fathers will sometimes pay for wiring at the home of their grown children, and they want the bill made out to them so that the work is a gift. Some people operate home based businesses, and want some of the electrical work at their home in the biz name to write it off. I could actually care less who I write the bill out to. I'll let anyone at all pay a bill.

On the matter of exactly what was done for the notations, could you just simply propose to them that you write "labor" and "materials", and leave it at that? No fraud on your end that way. They can do with that whatever they want.

It's obvious what they're doing, but I think a middle ground can be met that would satisfy both of you.
 
Quite honestly I've done exactly what your customer asked you to do Scott. If they are happy, so am I.

I'm not so righteous to care.

I thought your were wrong, it is all about the money?:confused:

Have you never skirted the "guidelines"? Filled up the wife's car on the company gas card? Taken cash for a couple hundred dollar job and not claimed it?

If you haven't, I have.

edit: none of the items I described involved an insurance claim, fwiw....
 
Who gets billed - not my problem... Project address, and describtion becomes a wanantee record.... :roll: Next think he wants you to fix the lights in the warehouse..... :mad:

Either way its a tax dodge - a wright off at the warehouse but taxable at home. :rolleyes:
 
j_erickson said:
Quite honestly I've done exactly what your customer asked you to do Scott. If they are happy, so am I.

I'm not so righteous to care.

I thought your were wrong, it is all about the money?:confused:

Have you never skirted the "guidelines"? Filled up the wife's car on the company gas card? Taken cash for a couple hundred dollar job and not claimed it?

If you haven't, I have.
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I would give up my liabilaty protection for anyone, that is not just simple fraud, it's criminal when the fraud is against his insurance underwriter. Hr is doing the right thing by refusing, these are the same people thay would think nothing about putting him in the fire.

"Have you never skirted the "guidelines"? Filled up the wife's car on the company gas card? Taken cash for a couple hundred dollar job and not claimed it? "


No I have not.
 
j_erickson said:
I thought your were wrong, it is all about the money?:confused:
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Oh no, it's all about the money. I did get paid. :grin:

I just don't want any part of their scam. The guy is a real dbag. Mr. My S don't stink and I want to make sure you know it. NO favors for these types from me.

Rest assured if something went wrong at the warehouse I never actually set foot in I would not have this guy backing me up.

Trust me, I'm no angel. I'll leave it at that. :wink:
 
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electricmanscott said:
I just don't want any part of their scam. The guy is a real dbag. Mr. My S don't stink and I want to make sure you know it. NO favors for these types from me.
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The picture is much clearer now.:cool:
 
Cutting corners for yourself is one thing, but this guy is asking you to take part in his fraud. You're an accessory after the fact to whatever he has in mind, and I doubt you know all that he has in mind.

For sure, if there is a bag to be held, neither he nor his wife will be holding it. They won't even be in the same room as the bag.
 
I use the same type of invoice for both residential and commercial. The first address on the invoice is " Billed to:" and the second address is the "Job site:" location. This is common in commercial because the job site is normally not where the bill ends up ( it's will be at the corporate home office )

I'm more than happy to put any address that the customer wants on the "Billed to" section but the "Job site " is the actual location where the work was done and there will be a discription of what work was done.

If a customer wishes to pay for home repairs from a company account that's just fine with me. A check is a check.

If the customer wants to cheat on their taxes that's their problem but they will have to accidentally lose the invoice.

I will not fake an invoice because that's fraud.
 
growler said:
I use the same type of invoice for both residential and commercial. The first address on the invoice is " Billed to:" and the second address is the "Job site:" location. This is common in commercial because the job site is normally not where the bill ends up ( it's will be at the corporate home office )

I'm more than happy to put any address that the customer wants on the "Billed to" section but the "Job site " is the actual location where the work was done and there will be a discription of what work was done.

If a customer wishes to pay for home repairs from a company account that's just fine with me. A check is a check.

If the customer wants to cheat on their taxes that's their problem but they will have to accidentally lose the invoice.

I will not fake an invoice because that's fraud.
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That is how most companies invoice work.
 
Years ago, when I was a contractor, a similar situation occurred.
I worked in both the commercial space and the manager's home. He asked me to send his bill to the commercial location for his house and he would clear it for payment.
I was the only contractor not to do that. I was immediately fired from work at the commercial space, but was paid.

6 months later his fraud was uncovered (along with other allegations). He and all of the contractors were brought up on charges. It ruined his life and set the other contractors back substantially as well as making the news.
So, good for you.
 
i have a friend sitting in a federal penitentiary right now for doing something like this. he was a landscaping contractor and did work at the home of the person in charge of a certain facility. he went to federal prison because he was paid with federal funds for the job. he was starving for work and did whatever he needed to do to get paid. the guy he did the work for and that person's secretary are also in federal prison. he's been there almost 3 years now and has another 2 to go. oh and his wife had a baby two months before he was sentenced. bad situation.
 
I agree with MD Shunk on this. Put the bill in the customers name and nothing else. Let him do what he wants with it. There's no reason you should do anything that may get you in trouble, just make it vague. Then you have a happy customer, and future work.


I have this train of thought when it comes to PITA customers, do what ever work they want, smile really big as you make out the really big bill and take their money. Don't make it personal, it's all about the money.
 
SmithBuilt said:
There's no reason you should do anything that may get you in trouble, just make it vague. Then you have a happy customer, and future work.
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why make an invoice vague? You are required to give a warranty on the work. It's important that the invoice state exactly what was done and that's what's covered.

If they want a receipt for the money paid that can be vague. I carry a receipt book and will write a receipt for electrical work and an invioce number on the receipt. The invoice should always state what was done to limit liability. A persons memory is not worth spit in court but any document written at the time is. A written document always carries more weight than some verbal memory of facts.
 
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