Debate again on BASEBOARD heaters under receptacles

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brother

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Well, I know this is going on AGAIN!! I think I 'upset' my fellow electrician. But he claims it would be 'grandfathered' in, and I told him no it would not according to the manufacturers instructions.

He replaced a baseboard heater under a receptacle (its about 10" above the heater, but the cord can't stay away more than 6") and he says since he's just replacing the 'existing' baseboard heater that was already under the receptacle, he's fine.

I say no, because the instructions CLEARLY say
instructions said:
do not install under receptacle outlets, and keep electric cords etc.. at least 6" away.
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This is where NEC 110 2008 would come into play. I say it's a new heater and you have to follow their instructions, and this cannot be grandfathered.
He's mad at me now over this issue. I know, Im being technical again, but hey as a famous man said, 'It is Written'.

What do you think??
 
This is not clear "do not install under receptacle outlets" because it has no zone defined (would 50ft under be ok?), but this "... at least 6" away" seems to indicate the zone of concern is 6".

If you insist, he could always find a unit that does not have that broad of a restriction and then you would have no choice but to allow it.
 
mivey said:
This is not clear "do not install under receptacle outlets" because it has no zone defined (would 50ft under be ok?), but this "... at least 6" away" seems to indicate the zone of concern is 6".

If you insist, he could always find a unit that does not have that broad of a restriction and then you would have no choice but to allow it.
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Im not the inspector, so its not a pass or fail situation. I agree the 'zone' should be defined, this has been brought up to the manufacturers, but they also say 'verbally' that even if the receptacle is 12" above that it is not recommended to install a baseboard heater under. I think they just say that for liability reason.

What do you think the 'zone' should be??
 
brother said:
What do you think the 'zone' should be??
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Whatever the manufacturer documents, so somewhere between 6" and geosynchronous orbit.

Verbal recommend/shmecommend. They are just too slack to be precise. Another manufacturer may not have similar heat issues and may actually put more effort in their documentation.

Personally: 6"
Technically: It Is Written.
 
Which one of you is the boss ? If neither then i would make written data and take pictures to save yourself. The reason for code changes is we learn from mistakes. Are you sure this old heater was ever legally installed? Just being there proves nothing.
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
Which one of you is the boss ? If neither then i would make written data and take pictures to save yourself. The reason for code changes is we learn from mistakes. Are you sure this old heater was ever legally installed? Just being there proves nothing.
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That is true, I don't know how long ago the other baseboard heater was there, I just know its been some years. It appears that the receptacles were installed AFTER the old heaters were already there. They (previous electricians) apparently ran some surface raceway to put in some receptacles and they installed dead center about the baseboards.
Not sure why they did it that way. By the way, neither of us is the boss LOL ;).
 
Put in 2 smaller baseboard heaters with a gap under the receptacle. This would cover the clearance requirement and still give the same heat into the room. Explain to the homeowner that you have given him better protection by removing any possible safety concern by melting wires.
 
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