Dedicated circuit "recommended"

[JoeNorm]

Seems like a microwave built-in is one that should be dedicated because it may draw quite a bit.

Ice maker, trash compactor, beverage/wine fridge maybe not so much.

I agree, more than 2 SA circuits is a good idea in a bigger/high end kitchen. If you toast bread and make a coffee on one circuit you could easily trip. More circuits make that less likely to happen.

 

[jaggedben]

But if the microwave is unusable because it's tripping the breaker, it can just be unplugged and you could still use the circuit.

...

But that means someone noticed and went to the basement to flip the breaker back on.

The microwave is probably a bad example because it's used consciously and due to its power draw it arguably should have a dedicated circuit anyway. But take the fridges for example. Suppose the beverage fridge likes to trip an AFCI randomly when it cycles on when no one is home, and you have the wine fridge on the same circuit. Now the expensive wine got warm while the customer was away for the weekend.

I'm not saying that particular appliance is more likely to be a problem, just trying to show an example of how AFCI nusiance trips could factor into your thinking. Like, the higher the stakes for something staying on, the better argument for it being on a dedicated circuit so the customer is less unhappy when something else trips the breaker. (If the high stakes thing itself trips the breaker, then there's nothing you could have done about that.)

 

[James L]

Like, the higher the stakes for something staying on, the better argument for it being on a dedicated circuit

I can agree with that. It's a good point

 

[petersonra]

There's nothing that prevents a customer from asking for more circuits than are required if they are willing to pay for it. It's not something the electrician should be deciding though. Once the electrician supplies the bare minimum code requirements, anything beyond that is up to the guy footing the bill.

 

[jmellc]

But if the microwave is unusable because it's tripping the breaker, it can just be unplugged and you could still use the circuit.

I wired a kitchen last Spring, and immediately had problems with a microwave drawer on a dedicated circuit tripping afci when cooking.

But in late summer started having problems with a beverage center circuit. 3 countertop receps and 2 under-counter appliances. It was easy enough to determine which appliance, Because they had just moved their coffee maker to that countertop.

I asked them to just unplug the coffee maker until I can get there in a few days. So they moved it back to where it was before, and waited until I came.

It didn't need multiple circuits at all.

IMHO, AFCI is the antiChrist of the electrical world. I have seen no benefit from it. It has driven up the cost of work even before Covid. I’ve replaced dozens, maybe hundreds of devices burned up by backstabbing, but the AFCI’s never tripped. Yet, they trip because the don’t “like” some coffee pot? So customer has to pay for a service call and buy another coffee pot too? What’s next? A different microwave?

We need the mother of all Kool Ade parties. Attendance mandatory for AFCI reps & Code officials. Jim Jones left a stash somewhere, I’m sure.

 

[readydave8]

Personally, I would like to see required countertop circuits go from 2 to 3, or even 4.

I rarely go as low as only 2 SABC, only when special circumstances, more likely to run 4 than 3

But opposed to code change for competitive reasons

I like.to not be lowest bid, but like to have good reasons for customer to pay more

 

[James L]

I rarely go as low as only 2 SABC, only when special circumstances, more likely to run 4 than 3

I've run as many as 22 in a residential kitchen. But I've also wired some very small.

I recently had an ADU kitchen which had only 3 countertop receps + fridge.

I wired one 4 years ago with only 1 countertop recep + fridge. I didn't even want to put 2 circuits there, but I had to.

 

[Frank DuVal]

I wired one 4 years ago with only 1 countertop recep + fridge. I didn't even want to put 2 circuits there, but I had to.

Only 2 feet of countertop space? That's small! One of those "small houses"? Why do I say 2 feet? because if it was 3 or 4 feet I would have put two receptacles in myself.

 

[James L]

Only 2 feet of countertop space? That's small! One of those "small houses"? Why do I say 2 feet? because if it was 3 or 4 feet I would have put two receptacles in myself.

It was a studio apartment above a garage.
The entire kitchen wall was about 7 feet

Tiny fridge, tiny sink, tiny oven.
Countertop was about 20 inches if I remember

 

[FionaZuppa]

Call appliance maker and ask "why do you recommend that?"
Don't be surprised if they can't tell you why.

 

[micabay]

What if putting in that many circuits resulted in the need for a larger and more expensive load center?

Good point. I forget that most folk's homes aren't 1100 sq feet like my own...