Defective Receptacle

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jhawkbb

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We were trimming out a house the other day and had a dead short on a circuit when we turned the breaker on. We found the problem pretty quickly when we saw a receptacle and the wall around it all black. Took the receptacle out and verified that it was wired correctly then noticed that the front of the receptacle was floppy. Broke it in half and saw that there was a screw inside the receptacle going across both the hot and neutral prongs. We took the receptacle to the parts store to exchange it and they kept it to show the Leviton rep. The rep didn't believe that it was possible but whatever. But I got to thinking that it would have really sucked if someone had tried to install that receptacle with the circuit on.
 
I had a batch of P&S TR receptacles where the shutters were seized and some of them cracked because the customer was trying to force the plugs into them.
 
jhawkbb said:
We were trimming out a house the other day and had a dead short on a circuit when we turned the breaker on. We found the problem pretty quickly when we saw a receptacle and the wall around it all black. Took the receptacle out and verified that it was wired correctly then noticed that the front of the receptacle was floppy. Broke it in half and saw that there was a screw inside the receptacle going across both the hot and neutral prongs. We took the receptacle to the parts store to exchange it and they kept it to show the Leviton rep. The rep didn't believe that it was possible but whatever. But I got to thinking that it would have really sucked if someone had tried to install that receptacle with the circuit on.
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Defective equipment is one of the many reasons why working hot is almost always against the rules/OSHA. You can commit no errors (aside from unnecessarily working live eqpt) and still get shocked or burned, or worse.

Did you happen to take any pics?
 
I'd guess somebody was working on some automated equipment and dropped a screw.
 
JFletcher said:
Defective equipment is one of the many reasons why working hot is almost always against the rules/OSHA. You can commit no errors (aside from unnecessarily working live eqpt) and still get shocked or burned, or worse.

Did you happen to take any pics?
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I wish I had taken pics. Like I said, it was obvious just by looking around the room and seeing the blackened recep and wall around it. We try not to work things hot but sometimes, as stupid as it sounds, its just easier. Makes you really think about working things hot though. Could have done everything right and still got messed up due to a defective recep. Just not worth it. Going to be that guy and killing circuits from now on. I have a family to go home to at night.
 
jhawkbb said:
I wish I had taken pics. Like I said, it was obvious just by looking around the room and seeing the blackened recep and wall around it. We try not to work things hot but sometimes, as stupid as it sounds, its just easier. Makes you really think about working things hot though. Could have done everything right and still got messed up due to a defective recep. Just not worth it. Going to be that guy and killing circuits from now on. I have a family to go home to at night.
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I always try to de energize a circuit before working on it also. But I end up working 120 control voltage hot all the time. I am a firm believer in the old saying "be smart about the stupid things you do." I always use insulated tools, and wear rubber gloves, work boots and safety glasses.
 
peter d said:
I had a batch of P&S TR receptacles where the shutters were seized and some of them cracked because the customer was trying to force the plugs into them.
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We had a hundred or so of these P&S receptacles that were defective.

yT8AfzDr30xRQcyVhJp252EmkeK2RXvPpO_rGrqD2EROFN9bCX3P5-lCAp_Jli1y9djpc8Afl_GIkH122Dpa06py-9uNvv6TpeS-AsrrmZLEgNGi3i_MEdvTH8i3NX7KO1kWtftkkC2wclRdKRN1uk9Un5YMv2v6yPWWixrlbpusYFJ-F7sb8KkIEx7Ac87lp03lGEVftCPm-VixKnymXR5vulJ5aybJP2nye49Vf4K2Rb-OFW_cztVtazneFG0KfvtG2acDFn8GW0ndWuMC37ExN4AKMp0j5n4WjSuI3tsu-Cd1sGee16LSgoZOeRL3ZAB3dzrfCwu6puGImcFU7Qv8Ewd-FRpNnQl3BYEoZlzlJDggoUNM5yDF_7TNHANH-K5wBwxfr79ulcITbptx8AuCJQHrJcRIW_dtHUcSL-LjP51xn3KyEJf7o0dzValV36UyoxGZVbYmFbIGLGG8GWcZowz9EkJIf3dvEUDeiEV4GwO6JH_zakPUSfC_uHTkhG0lbHATM7yNdgF7-HLlOtwioGQyylj4djHmN4gSilMxnYLbXrCNDIEN_m-55Dit9_BF6oxsZM6oOtCkFg5_V7JCNmoXs5ST=w781-h1380-no
 
I've had two seperate incidences where luckily I caught it durring/before installation

1) had a piece of 12/2/G nm-b that felt a little wrinkled and fat, cut it open and it had a crimp butt splice within.
Imagine if a fire broke out at that spot, how convincing do you think investigators would be that you didn't put it there. Especially if some one died as a result......stuff like that makes you want to quit.

2) had a piece of 12/3/G that durring the twisting process the machine went haywire and twisted it so tight that it split the insulation on the conductors creating a short.

Things like this may be the only reason I would endorse afci's.
 
I would have to have access to the UL documents to be sure, but AFAIK if the cable manufacturer puts an approved/tested splice inside the cable as part of the assembly process (they have to change source spools eventually unless it is a continuous manufacturing process) that does not create an NEC violation.
 
GoldDigger said:
I would have to have access to the UL documents to be sure, but AFAIK if the cable manufacturer puts an approved/tested splice inside the cable as part of the assembly process (they have to change source spools eventually unless it is a continuous manufacturing process) that does not create an NEC violation.
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Why not just cut the last x number of feet to a cut length of 15' (smallest pre-packaged length that Im aware of) instead of a butt splice under the jacket? or discard/scrap/remelt-remake the end of the run? Ive never seen a butt splice in NM, never heard of it until now.
 
JFletcher said:
Why not just cut the last x number of feet to a cut length of 15' (smallest pre-packaged length that Im aware of) instead of a butt splice under the jacket? or discard/scrap/remelt-remake the end of the run? Ive never seen a butt splice in NM, never heard of it until now.
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Years ago an inspector friend of mine told me a story about when he was a contractor. He lost power to an outlet and after more than enough time spent, he decided to rip out the wall a bit and pull a run of NM cable. Inside the cable, done by the manufacturer, was a Western Union splice. It had failed.
 
JFletcher said:
Why not just cut the last x number of feet to a cut length of 15' (smallest pre-packaged length that Im aware of) instead of a butt splice under the jacket? or discard/scrap/remelt-remake the end of the run? Ive never seen a butt splice in NM, never heard of it until now.
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Probably because at that point of the manufacture there was a minimum run length far above the minimum package length. Final cutting and packaging may not even happen in the same building....maybe not even the same city.
 
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