Disconnect /Reconnect Utility

[Hv&Lv]

depends on circumstances. If my power supplier were investor owned I doubt I would have the low rate I have, and the service probably wouldn't be as dependable as it is.

Same cooperative does supply power to nearby towns and subdivisions, facilities charges are lower in those areas, rates I don't remember, but if they are lower it isn't much lower. Bottom line is their budget doesn't include payments to investors instead they reinvest any funds that would otherwise be called profits back into the system.

No, the “profits” are called “margins” and are redistributed to the members.

 

[ptonsparky]

I heard a good analogy many years ago..
Co-op power is like buying a loaf of bread at the country store. It costs a little more than the bread in a box store in the city..
It’s all about customers per mile as stated by someone earlier..

The Co-op benefit around here is customer service. An electrician calls us, we will meet you there and cut it loose, and come back later. If we get back there before your done we may even help you finish..
Weekend emergencies, we will help with that too.. get the inspection within a week. We have no problem with that.
We have enough sense to know what will pass and what won’t on a weekend emergency call...

That is what we have. Good reliable power and service. Fortunately I’ve been around long enough that when I call, I don’t have to wade through the new Call Center for the bigger POCO in the area. The 40 year old number still gets me to a person that knows something.

 

[kwired]

No, the “profits” are called “margins” and are redistributed to the members.

I have never gotten any distribution checks. They do put a lot of effort into budget, and the anticipated "margins" are considered and future outlook is also considered. Around here if anything any excess is spent on community projects or donated to community needs. There is no direct distribution back to the actual service account holders.

Often rate schedules are changed on an annual basis. If things went well enough they may keep current rates for another year. I think I have had same rate for 3 -5 years right now. They have helped this with changes in other areas though. For example there may be more upfront cost for extending/adding/upgrading your service then there used to be in some cases.

At one time there was little or no charge for a lot of those activities.

 

[Electricmo]

Here at the cooperative I work for they return capital credits back to the members. It may be a while. I was just given a credit dating back to 1998. It was around $100. The company returns these occasionally and every member who was on the system on the dates returned is eligible for these credits either on bill or a check if no longer on system.

 

[kwired]

Here at the cooperative I work for they return capital credits back to the members. It may be a while. I was just given a credit dating back to 1998. It was around $100. The company returns these occasionally and every member who was on the system on the dates returned is eligible for these credits either on bill or a check if no longer on system.

How many members from back then are now deceased?

seems you can avoid paying at least some of them by waiting 20 years to issue the payment.

I'd rather they spend the funds on community projects, or reinvest into the system, which should in turn continue to help keep rates low.

 

[retirede]

Here at the cooperative I work for they return capital credits back to the members. It may be a while. I was just given a credit dating back to 1998. It was around $100. The company returns these occasionally and every member who was on the system on the dates returned is eligible for these credits either on bill or a check if no longer on system.

Same here. I get a statement each year telling me the capital credits I’ve earned.
They only get paid out when the board deems it fiscally responsible to do so.

I got a check earlier this year for credits earned sometime in the ‘90s. It was for about $50.

 

[Electricmo]

How many members from back then are now deceased?

seems you can avoid paying at least some of them by waiting 20 years to issue the payment.

I'd rather they spend the funds on community projects, or reinvest into the system, which should in turn continue to help keep rates low.

All heirs are eligible for the credits. Each cooperative here in Missouri keeps a list of unclaimed credits.

 

[kwired]

Same here. I get a statement each year telling me the capital credits I’ve earned.
They only get paid out when the board deems it fiscally responsible to do so.

I got a check earlier this year for credits earned sometime in the ‘90s. It was for about $50.

If that were all investors were to get from investor owned companies they would put their money elsewhere, but then again the average residential or light commercial customer isn't putting that much in to begin with

 

[Hv&Lv]

How many members from back then are now deceased?

seems you can avoid paying at least some of them by waiting 20 years to issue the payment.

I'd rather they spend the funds on community projects, or reinvest into the system, which should in turn continue to help keep rates low.

Once a member dies any and all credits are paid to the estate in full.

 

[zbang]

That is basically the definition of a coop.

(post 53?)

Not really-
"coops" are member/customer owned
"public systems" (e.g. Palo Alto, Alameda, Santa Clara, Sac'to, etc) are municipally-owned ("by the public")
"price-gouging weasels" are investor owned

And I think there are still some privately-owned/public-serving water systems in CA.

 

[jaggedben]

That is basically the definition of a coop.

No it's not. A coop is a private entity. Public power is run by the government. A key difference is that the latter may be able to fund itself with tax money.

 

[kwired]

Google "cooperative definition" and you get:

a farm, business, or other organization which is owned and run jointly by its members, who share the profits or benefits.

Sounds exactly like what we have for electric power utilities around here.

I don't believe they have any government involvement in their operations other than to follow any laws that apply to them.

The municipal utilities that are around do have a city council that intervenes to some extent, but the utility itself still has it's own board members and their own meetings for conducting utility business and making budget decisions. Their actions often still must be submitted to city council and council has to approve those actions, but most of the time they do, they are basically like a separate department within the city government with their own supervisory board, just like the police, fire, rescue, parks and recreation department, water/sewer, etc.

 

[Hv&Lv]

Google "cooperative definition" and you get:

a farm, business, or other organization which is owned and run jointly by its members, who share the profits or benefits.

Sounds exactly like what we have for electric power utilities around here.

I don't believe they have any government involvement in their operations other than to follow any laws that apply to them.

The municipal utilities that are around do have a city council that intervenes to some extent, but the utility itself still has it's own board members and their own meetings for conducting utility business and making budget decisions. Their actions often still must be submitted to city council and council has to approve those actions, but most of the time they do, they are basically like a separate department within the city government with their own supervisory board, just like the police, fire, rescue, parks and recreation department, water/sewer, etc.

Utility cooperatives are under the USRDA. REA was replaced with RUS a few years back. Government set them up.

 

[kwired]

Utility cooperatives are under the USRDA. REA was replaced with RUS a few years back. Government set them up.

Government set them up, but that was like around 90 years ago.

USDA's RUS program may be there for help when needed, but AFAIK they don't own or operate these systems.
What I see is they are more like the SBA would be to me running a small business. I think even for profit utilities are eligible for their services though not for profits maybe get higher priority.

 

[kwired]

I haven't seen or heard of USDA involvement in an electric utility project, but seen many water projects where they are involved and possibly some communications projects.

The electric utilities around here generally are doing well on their own, and often are giving back to the communities they serve in various ways.

 

[Hv&Lv]

Government set them up, but that was like around 90 years ago.

USDA's RUS program may be there for help when needed, but AFAIK they don't own or operate these systems.
What I see is they are more like the SBA would be to me running a small business. I think even for profit utilities are eligible for their services though not for profits maybe get higher priority.

No, they aren’t.

 

[Hv&Lv]

I haven't seen or heard of USDA involvement in an electric utility project, but seen many water projects where they are involved and possibly some communications projects.

The electric utilities around here generally are doing well on their own, and often are giving back to the communities they serve in various ways.

They are, where you think the loans come from...

 

[kwired]

No, they aren’t.

What "arent"?

They are, where you think the loans come from...

I didn't say they were not eligible to use them, I just don't hardly ever hear of it, but see many water projects that use USDA's programs.

POCO's here seem to be well managed and have funds to give back more so than they need to borrow from what I have seen.

I suppose they possibly take out loans for certain projects or for a non predicted major necessary expense from time to time, but probably do pay them back pretty quickly.

 

[Hv&Lv]

What "arent"?

for profit utilities aren’t eligible to use RUS funds

I didn't say they were not eligible to use them, I just don't hardly ever hear of it, but see many water projects that use USDA's programs.

POCO's here seem to be well managed and have funds to give back more so than they need to borrow from what I have seen.

I suppose they possibly take out loans for certain projects or for a non predicted major necessary expense from time to time, but probably do pay them back pretty quickly.

The loans aren’t advertised, but are disclosed at annual meetings and financial disclosures.
they are extremely low interest loans generally borrowed for 3 year work plans.
Take a look at your cooperatives financials. Unless there are LOTS of members and little rebuilding, they have RUS loans.

there are many cooperatives that fall below TIER and are on the brink of bankruptcy.
usually ran by people that have never been in a “for profit” world.

 

[mtnelect]

Out here in sunny Southern California we have Proposition 13, property taxes can't go up more than 1% a year. Local governments didn't like that so among other things, they started charging reconnection fees as high as $500.00. Also you have to pull a city business license before you pull the permit. Also, we have Digital Meters with locks. Pay the fees and the meter is unlocked for 30 days. So, on a Service Upgrade pull the meter, disconnect and reconnect, and it's done.