Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

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charlie b

charlie b

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Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
This Forum has the feature of conducting polls, but this feature has not yet been used. I would like to give the feature a try.

Some engineers use ?tick marks? on ?floor plan? drawings, to show how many conductors (i.e., phase, neutral, ground) are required in each section of conduit. For example, the floor plan of an office building might have three circuits serving 30 receptacle outlets. The drawing might show a curved line from each receptacle to the next one along the wall. The line between two receptacles might have three tick marks, meaning one phase, one neutral, and one ground. The line between two other receptacles might have four tick marks, meaning two phase, one neutral, and one ground.

I would like know whether electrical contractors pay attention to those tick mark symbols, or whether you figure out on your own how to run the conductors from device to device to device.

Feel free to send me a Private Message, if you have any information or stories you would like to share.

Here?s the Question:
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  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Do you (or did you, in earlier days) plan or execute your installation of a project (or estimate the cost of the project) on the basis of the number of tick marks that are shown on floor plans?</font>
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Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

They are important in the estimating stage of the job. Sometimes they are obviously incorrect. They can be a good guide for the field installers but always have to verify.
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

The pole question may not be the correct way to present this.
I always look at the tick marks as refrence but do not use them as a definite. you always have do a little more detail to make sure you are pulling the correct number of conductors.
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

I must say I agree with both Jim and Shelco.

Roger
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

Interesting poll Charlie. I would like to see the results, but I don't feel qualified to vote since I am not an electrician. I do place tick marks on drawings, but I don't know if they are ever used.

Steve
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

I am sure that Charlie will post the results after he feels like the "results are in." The answers would be skewed IMO if the existing results are posted before everyone who wanted to vote did vote. I have looked at them and found them interesting but can't vote since I don't work . . . UH . . . don't do electrical work any more either. :D
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

I have set up the poll to end at noon Monday, May 9. I'll post the results then.
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

Originally posted by charlie:I . . . can't vote since I don't do electrical work any more either. :D
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Actually, I am interested in the opinions of those who once did electrical construction work, even if they are now inspectors, or instructors, or retired, or lottery winners, or whatever.
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

I think they are a waste of time to put on the drawing unless it is to clairify something that is abnormal.

What I like is to see just a circuit number next to the device or the circuit jumped with a curved line and an arrow to designate the feed circuit number and panel.

I have never used the drawing to run the circuit as drawn, you know device to device.
I feel that the drawing is a guide to only show what is on the same circuit the tic marks just clutter the drawing and leave an opening for a change order for some aggresive EC's that like to use minor typo's for an extra (that's a whole other discussion). :eek:

Just show me whats on the circuit and where it goes and let me figure out the rest. A good estimator would agree. A culttered drawing leaves a chance that something will get missed.
The actual routing and jumping from device to device should be determined by the installing electrician. Then just mark the circuit jumping on an asbuilt drawing if that is what is required.

[ May 06, 2005, 06:36 PM: Message edited by: tkb ]
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

I would have to say they are a waste of time when drawn on a blue-print, unless they bring attention to something that is requested, but not actually "required" Or something very specific (Parallel feeds, Dedicated circuits, isolated grounds, etc.)
Oddly enough, that is exactly how I draw wiring diagrams of MY jobs, (for future reference) but that is AFTER they are wired.

Dave
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

Funny, I agree with everyone so far.

They are useful for the estimating stage. Especially on a job with an EE designing it already. They act as a great reference if not always accurate.

Also, they can be annoying when anyone in their right mind would look at the distribution system and have a different way of doing it.

I say it depends. If I am to cast my vote, I vote for Carrie Underwood, or maybe Bo Bice. Aahh, I am doing it again.
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

I'm not an estimator, but I think they're useful for installation in larger installations where many electricians are working. If used for actual installation they make "as built" drawings a lot easier to produce. Post construction they're useful while using the "as builts" when planning, troubleshooting and just plain understanding what's above the ceiling or under your feet. I'm speaking from the aspect of large commercial/industrial construction. :)
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

The tick marks I find to be useful in the estimating process, but I do not follow them during construction.

So since there was not a (Sometimes) answer I will decline to vote.

Steve
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

Like any set of design prints will/should state, it is up to the designer to verify the accuracy and functionality of the prints. So, I really answer, yes but no.
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

The results are interesting but more replies are needed to get better results. Even if you do not normally participate in the forum, your response wold be appreciated. :D
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

Originally posted by charlie:
The results are interesting but more replies are needed to get better results.
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It's a pretty exclusive question. None of us housemonkey's can join in! :)

Actually, my home's prints had not only those tick marks, but the lines were either solid, dotted or dashed to display if they were run in the floor, wall or ceiling. Now that I'm in the trade, I consider that to be pretty durn funny. An engineer did not rope my house, so his guess on where the wiring is located is as good as mine. :D

[ May 08, 2005, 09:53 AM: Message edited by: georgestolz ]
 
Re: Do you pay attention to "Tick Marks"?

a lot of drawings I have seen lately show an inaccurate # of marks or no marks at all.
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The Engineers probably realize that we don't pay attention to them anyway.

Its easy to layout the wires when looking at a print, but they should pick up a drill and pull some wires before "showing us" how they think we should do it.

This statement is not true across the board. I have found some engineers to do a great job, these people make my job easier. I can hand my crew a print and tell them to run with it, others I will need to layout all the work.
 
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