e-tyre innovation

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Besoeker said:
Yes, but where does the energy for that come from in the first place? The vehicle propulsion system maybe?



Maybe not. The original posted is claiming 2-3kW. If true, that would be in the region of 200A at 12V. Far more than the sensors would require. So, if you wanted to harvest it for other uses, you would need to extract it from the rotating wheels and into the car somehow and that would require some form of sliding contacts.
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You are correct. I was just trying to explore possibilities. The sensors would only need microwatts.

As for the 2-3 kW.....If it were possible, that much power would have to have either violated the laws of physics or put some additional drag on the vehicle. You won't get 4 hp from the wheels without needing 4 hp from the car, as has been pointed out. The advantage of the system, to me, would be a place to put power on rotating parts connected to the wheels.

The sensors are a small load on the wheel. If 1 hp was available at each wheel, this may be applied to braking or traction control systems. Maybe even an air compressor that could compensate for small leaks in the tire.

But anyway, the cart is already before the horse. Without a working model we can volley dreams and arguments all day long and nothing will be proved.

Like it has been said, 'If you build it, they will come.'

:)
 
weressl said:
...and who introduces the issue of 'electric car' only to knock down the double conversion insensibility? Or were you just trying to demonstrate that you DO understand what a strawman argument is.

NOBODY claimed a free lunch, with ANY of the arguments.
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The condescending attitude is unnecessary. The OP mentioned electric cars early on.
 
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ggunn said:
The condescending attitude is unnecessary. The OP mentioned electric cars early on.
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Sorry, my mistake. You're correct and I was wrong. All along I was thinking of a combustion engine driven machine.

Yet even with an electricity driven vehicle there is a possible way that this produces a positive net gain energy. Some of the energy loss is due to the compression of the rubber in the tire - as it rolls - and that is converted to heat that is an obvious loss. Now if some of that energy now used to compress the piezzo crystal and regain energy from it, instead of heat loss, then indeed we would have some recovered usable energy.
 
weressl said:
Sorry, my mistake. You're correct and I was wrong. All along I was thinking of a combustion engine driven machine.

Yet even with an electricity driven vehicle there is a possible way that this produces a positive net gain energy. Some of the energy loss is due to the compression of the rubber in the tire - as it rolls - and that is converted to heat that is an obvious loss. Now if some of that energy now used to compress the piezzo crystal and regain energy from it, instead of heat loss, then indeed we would have some recovered usable energy.
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THANKS lot..., in india not even supplier of piezo crystal also not available. i may lost this projects. but its not my end..
 
srinivasan said:
THANKS lot..., in india not even supplier of piezo crystal also not available. i may lost this projects. but its not my end..
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If you're looking for relatively free energy, I'd suggest you look at regenerative braking schemes. As it stands, work has to be performed to compress the piezoelectric material. That's the work that's not "free". Regenerative braking converts the vehicle's kinetic energy into electricity by slowing the vehicle. Since you =want= to slow a vehicle when the brakes are applied, this energy is "free" in the sense that it would otherwise have been turned into heat.
 
tallgirl said:
If you're looking for relatively free energy, I'd suggest you look at regenerative braking schemes. As it stands, work has to be performed to compress the piezoelectric material. That's the work that's not "free". Regenerative braking converts the vehicle's kinetic energy into electricity by slowing the vehicle. Since you =want= to slow a vehicle when the brakes are applied, this energy is "free" in the sense that it would otherwise have been turned into heat.
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Yeah, if you look earlier in this thread you'll see that we went round and round about this. Anything that harvests energy from the wheels turning is going to make it require more energy to turn the wheels. In braking, making the wheels harder to turn is the point.
 
tallgirl said:
If you're looking for relatively free energy, I'd suggest you look at regenerative braking schemes. As it stands, work has to be performed to compress the piezoelectric material. That's the work that's not "free". Regenerative braking converts the vehicle's kinetic energy into electricity by slowing the vehicle. Since you =want= to slow a vehicle when the brakes are applied, this energy is "free" in the sense that it would otherwise have been turned into heat.
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regenerative is not in scope. yeah i know compressing the piezo is not a easy one and also when you compress, losses in piezo material is considerable one.
 
tallgirl said:
If you're looking for relatively free energy, I'd suggest you look at regenerative braking schemes. As it stands, work has to be performed to compress the piezoelectric material. That's the work that's not "free". Regenerative braking converts the vehicle's kinetic energy into electricity by slowing the vehicle. Since you =want= to slow a vehicle when the brakes are applied, this energy is "free" in the sense that it would otherwise have been turned into heat.
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Work is also - already - being performed compressing the tire, which turns into heat, eg. loss. Some of that energy is being recovered by compressing the piezzo crystals and turing it into electrical energy. Regenerative breaking will also occur compressing the piezzo crystals and generating electrical energy. I would venture to say that the maount of energy converted this way falls way short of the simple kinetic conversion of just the regenerative breaking, but unless numbers are trown up against it it remeains an open book, a case to be made.
 
weressl said:
Work is also - already - being performed compressing the tire, which turns into heat, eg. loss. Some of that energy is being recovered by compressing the piezzo crystals and turing it into electrical energy. Regenerative breaking will also occur compressing the piezzo crystals and generating electrical energy. I would venture to say that the maount of energy converted this way falls way short of the simple kinetic conversion of just the regenerative breaking, but unless numbers are trown up against it it remeains an open book, a case to be made.
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Lazlo,

I don't dispute that there is energy to be had. I do dispute that it is cheap or easy. Regenerative braking can be done relatively easily and relatively cheaply, compared to sandwiching a layer of piezoelectric crystals in a tire, capturing the electric energy, transferring it via some electrical connections between tire and vehicle, etc.
 
tallgirl said:
Lazlo,

I don't dispute that there is energy to be had. I do dispute that it is cheap or easy. Regenerative braking can be done relatively easily and relatively cheaply, compared to sandwiching a layer of piezoelectric crystals in a tire, capturing the electric energy, transferring it via some electrical connections between tire and vehicle, etc.
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Can you point out where I - or anyone else - claimed either cheap ore easy? The entire discussion was addressing theorethical feasibility.

BTW it is Laszlo....
 
weressl said:
The entire discussion was addressing theorethical feasibility.
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On that subject, I would like to introduce a different concept: The eShockAbsorber. It will use magnetic damping instead of viscous or hydraulic damping, and will generate electricity as it functions. Totally possible in theory, and would give you electronic control of the damping curve. I do not claim that it would generate enough power to be useful for anything, but it would generate power, and unlike the eTyre it would not reduce fuel efficiency in the process.
You do have to use it primarily on bumpy roads or test tracks though. :)
 
GoldDigger said:
On that subject, I would like to introduce a different concept: The eShockAbsorber. It will use magnetic damping instead of viscous or hydraulic damping, and will generate electricity as it functions. Totally possible in theory, and would give you electronic control of the damping curve. I do not claim that it would generate enough power to be useful for anything, but it would generate power, and unlike the eTyre it would not reduce fuel efficiency in the process.
You do have to use it primarily on bumpy roads or test tracks though. :)
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That may be something to look into for electric dirt bikes or ATVs, though!
 
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