Educate HI or move on

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eds said:
Little bit of an update, spoke with both the H.I. and the owner of inspection company, and there contention is they are not code violation inspectors, they are safety violation inspectors. So while not a code violation, it is a safety violation due to the fact that the ac unit could be changed out at a later date and then the wire could be to small ( ridiculous argument in my eyes). There training comes from a online certification program as well as having at there disposal a sounding board of professionals. I spoke to the fact that are code requirements in both the N.E.C and the I.R.C. (which we follow here) are presented as safety guides, and meeting these criteria provide a compliant installation. The fact is the wire change was a simple matter, but my biggest peeve about this, is they have the ability to hold up or prevent the sale of property based on there set of guidelines. Now do we not only have to install as per code standards, we must also anticipate there off base safety standards, ludicrous. While it cost me 5 or 6 hours of my life, i at least had entertaining conversations with H.I. and realtors which of course is priceless.
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The safety argument IS ridiculous, and furthermore, every time I have seen an HVAC unit changed out from an olderone 25 years ago, the breakers actually have to be downsized because the new unit is more efficient and requires a smaller MOCP.

while I don't agree that everything in the NEC is the best way of doing it, supposed safety violations of an NEC compliant installation would have to be listed somewhere or in a code that supersedes the NEC for a home inspector to gig or enforce, otherwise you are going to have shirt pocket rules like this made up all the time based on what inspector feels like that day, which is why I would have challenged it and squashed that stupidity from the get-go. a $700 repair to a code compliant installation? #$@& no. Also saying such an installation is not up to code or unsafe is borderline slander to the original installer.

if I had been called out on that job, I would have informed them that there was no problem found, and charged a nominal service charge for the time. Charging that kind of money to "fix" a problem that does not exist is the reason that places like Jiffy Lube get bashed in the head every couple years by Dateline and the like. I do not see how such repairs would not be out and out fraud.
 
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eds said:
So while not a code violation, it is a safety violation due to the fact that the ac unit could be changed out at a later date and then the wire could be to small ( ridiculous argument in my eyes).
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It is a ridiculous argument and sad.

Roger
 
eds said:
Little bit of an update, spoke with both the H.I. and the owner of inspection company, and there contention is they are not code violation inspectors, they are safety violation inspectors. So while not a code violation, it is a safety violation due to the fact that the ac unit could be changed out at a later date and then the wire could be to small ( ridiculous argument in my eyes).
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They are not only not code violation inspectors their opinions are not enforceable in any way.

It up to the buyer and the seller to determine if they wish to spend money on the opinion of a home inspector. If they are willing to spend money on this type of BS then I am willing to take it.

Many times on these home inspection reports they will just say that whatever needs to be checked out by a licensed electrician. When they state it this way way I will just write it up as being code compliant to start with.

If I had installed this wiring then I would give a permit number and date it passed inspection to show that it was in fact code compliant. Most buyers will accept this.
 
growler said:
They are not only not code violation inspectors their opinions are not enforceable in any way.

It up to the buyer and the seller to determine if they wish to spend money on the opinion of a home inspector. If they are willing to spend money on this type of BS then I am willing to take it.
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We've talked about this before. Many home buyers have no clue and think home inspectors are engineers or some kind of official whose report must be followed.

I recently had a seller want me to replace all the receptacles in a pre-GFI kitchen with GFIs and the same with two outdoor receptacles complete with in-use covers. That's what the HI report required and it was holding up the sale. Not that this is a bad idea, but there is no requirement to bring a house up to code when you sell it.

-Hal
 
I don’t know why the HIs haven’t caught with the AFCI craze yet.

We had an Instructor for CE a few years ago that was also a HI. I asked why they dinged older homes for lack of GFCIs. His comment was they inspected per current code. No further discussion. End of subject. So, I’m awaiting.
 
They have no business inspecting to any code- electrical, plumbing or anything else. They don't have the knowledge, qualification or authority to do that. All they are there for is to point out obvious deficiencies such as rot, leaking roof or basement, termites, heating or A/C not working, etc. If they are suspicious of an electrical situation that is not glaringly obvious like flying splices or no cover on a box then the report should only note them with the recommendation to have an EC follow up.

-Hal
 
eds said:
Little bit of an update, spoke with both the H.I. and the owner of inspection company, and there contention is they are not code violation inspectors, they are safety violation inspectors. So while not a code violation, it is a safety violation due to the fact that the ac unit could be changed out at a later date and then the wire could be to small ( ridiculous argument in my eyes). There training comes from a online certification program as well as having at there disposal a sounding board of professionals. I spoke to the fact that are code requirements in both the N.E.C and the I.R.C. (which we follow here) are presented as safety guides, and meeting these criteria provide a compliant installation. The fact is the wire change was a simple matter, but my biggest peeve about this, is they have the ability to hold up or prevent the sale of property based on there set of guidelines. Now do we not only have to install as per code standards, we must also anticipate there off base safety standards, ludicrous. While it cost me 5 or 6 hours of my life, i at least had entertaining conversations with H.I. and realtors which of course is priceless.
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I can see this, that's why every resi. service should be 3phase 1200 amp, never know what's going to be added!
Did I mention I'm tired of brain dead people and now retired I spout off at every chance?
PS. Get off my lawn!
 
sameguy said:
I can see this, that's why every resi. service should be 3phase 1200 amp, never know what's going to be added!
Did I mention I'm tired of brain dead people and now retired I spout off at every chance?
PS. Get off my lawn!
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Meanwhile... lol... if I want to wire someone’s home in JA with less than a 50 amp service, I do not need an electrical drawing or diagram... otherwise have to submit a drawing before applying for service connection...yet must have the work done before submitt8ng the drawing...

kinda like the instance i was putting in a driveway in the UK... had to do the hard pack... the dement and drainage and such.. then call for permit... and move it if they decided some problem was on the street or such... no come out first and tell me if this is possible or should put it there instead...no..do the work..spend your money..and rip it out if we decide it needs moved four feet over...lol
 
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