Electrical licensing opinion

[brother]

I know this may be a sensitive subject, but I just wanted to get another point of view. In certain states, when you work on that 'State' facilities electrical, and you are employed by THEM (the state) and not a contractor, you are not required to have a license, even though you are doing the work of an electrician. If you do the same exact work and employed by the contractor you are REQUUIRED to have a license.

I have mixed feelings about this, Im not saying the 'non' license people are not 'qualified' because you can 'train' just about anyone for the work, however in spirit of fairness it seems it should be required, as to take the state licensing you have to go through documented hours of training under a journeyman. What do you think?? and is this the same in other States??

 

[jrannis]

Its like that on Federal jobs as well.
Maybe they don't want to investigate the rules in each jurisdiction or better yet, they seem to have one supervisor for each tradesman working.

 

[goldstar]

In certain states, when you work on that 'State' facilities electrical, and you are employed by THEM (the state) and not a contractor, you are not required to have a license, even though you are doing the work of an electrician.

That's the way it is here in NJ. Whether you're employed by the State or any given company you may do electrical work within a facility. From what I understand most of the work is basically maintenance work (changing bulbs and ballasts, extending a circuit, etc.). However, when major work (like all the electrical work for a new building) is required, it usually doesn't pay for the State or a given company to use "in house" personnel (like the guy on the lawn tractor cutting the lawn) to do the work, not to mention that when something goes wrong they have no one to sue.

If you do the same exact work and employed by the contractor you are REQUIRED to have a license.

The reason licenses and business permits are issued is so that an electrical contractor can contract business with the public. Again, here in NJ a homeowner can pull a permit and do any level of electrical work on his/her own home. By the same token, if I'm that person's next door neighbor technically speaking I can't walk over and give them a hand or do the work without having a license. In addition, ANY work done in a commercial or industrial facility must be done by a licensed electrical contractor, irrespective of whether they own the building or not.

however in spirit of fairness it seems it should be required

There is no such thing as fairness but there are laws. In NJ, it is a 4th degree felony, punishable by a $1K fine (1st offense) and jail time for repeat offenders if you're caught contracting and doing electrical work without a license. Now, that's easier said than done. I haven't filed a complaint against anyone yet but you know they're out there. I see them at Big Orange every time I'm there, buying all kinds of electrical materials and not knowing what they are buying. I really start to cringe when they ask the HD employee what materials they need to change over their electric service. And, you know you're up against a hack when they beat your service upgrade price by $1K.

 

[tom baker]

Its basically the same in Washington. Electrical certification started in 1973 and the laws allow the full time employee of the property to do electrical work and not be certified.
This is a state issue, here I suspect its due to the additional cost this would have for property owners.

But- they still must get permits and inspections. I know that most don't, and thats where a lot of our unsafe work comes from.

Unfair? Maybe, but thats the way the laws were written.

 

[GrayHeadedMule]

In Texas a person that works for a city or state or even a company can do maintenance on the electrical as long as they work specifically for that company/city/state but they can't install "new" electrical.

Any "new" work must be installed by a state licensed electrician.

 

[RICK NAPIER]

In NJ its like Goldstar mentioned but an interesting fact is while goverment entities can use their own electrician they generally cannot draw the plans. In one municipality the "electrician's" primary resposibility appeared to be to empty the trash and sweep the floor. It was a small job and I told the school if he did the work I needed plans and if a licensed electrician did the work I would not need plans. It was cheaper to hire the electrician than an architect.

 

[btharmy]

In Indiana, there is no state license. Outside of a specific municipality that requires a license (most citys and some large towns), anyone with a magnetic sign on his truck can install electrical work as long as permits are pulled and it is inspected. Employees working within a location requiring a license are not themselves required to be licensed as long as a current license for that location is held by the employer.

 

[ceb58]

I have the best (or worst) of both. In my duties working for the state I am not requried to be licensed. Any new installations are supposed to be inspected by the dept. of insurance and any plans for that installation are provided by our own EE. However if we do any work on a leased building then it is requried to be done by someone licensed.
We were doing a complete remodel of a office building at one of the prisons which was just inside of the city limits. The city inspector came on the job with a go-to-hell attitude. He was ranting that he was stopping the work and writing fines for no permits and such. My supervisor at the time was on the job site that day. He calmly walked to the temp office we had set up and talked with the superintendent of the prison. In a few moments the inspector was escorted off the property by a armed officer and was told its state property and he had no jurisdiction there and if we needed him we would call.

 

[mdshunk]

I do a certain amount of work on a military base, and the guys employed on that base as electricians, although not licensed, can wire circles around most electricians I know.

 

[Ken9876]

That's the way it is here in NJ. Whether you're employed by the State or any given company you may do electrical work within a facility. From what I understand most of the work is basically maintenance work (changing bulbs and ballasts, extending a circuit, etc.). However, when major work (like all the electrical work for a new building) is required, it usually doesn't pay for the State or a given company to use "in house" personnel (like the guy on the lawn tractor cutting the lawn) to do the work, not to mention that when something goes wrong they have no one to sue.

And it just costs a heck of a lot more. Much of the contracted work I see is scary.

NJ requires employees of a company to be licensed journeyman, they also are changing the wording for state employees