Emergency Lighting in Elec/Mech Rooms

[Karl H]

Not even close. If someone simply adds a generator or UPS, they can pretty much put what ever they want on it.

The problem I see everyday is.People think that a gen set is E-Power.
It's not, it's a optional standby system. The customer chooses the load.

A legally Standby System, The government or other agency chooses the load.
Which has been said before in this thread.

 

[ptrip]

I am a stickler for terminology. The NEC does not use Life Safety Branch except in Health Care Facilities. In my eyes you would have an Emergency System and an Optional Satandby System.

I am not sure what a door opener is. Do you mean a hold open device? Since a hold open fail in the closed position, there is no reason save convenience to have them on the generator.

I would write a correction for the bath and electric room lighting.

Other than that, yes you are on the right track.

I agree and strongly urge anyone creating designs to apply the terminology to the systems as the NEC spells them out in 700.1, 701.1 and 702.1. If you start calling 'optional standby loads' 'emergency' the price of the bids will likely rise as contractors plan on keeping them separate from all other wiring.

Yes ... I have a required Emergency System and and Optional Standby System.

No ... the NEC does not typically reference "Life Safety" ... but the requirements of the egress path are spelled out in NFPA 101 Life Safety Code. The bulk of what is supplied by my Required Standby system is listed in the Life Safety Code. Hence the logic of the naming scheme.

I also have a theory that folks are less likely to add things willy nilly to a "Life Safety panel". What I see is that if you have a choice of a "Emergency Panel" and an "Standby Panel" the general consumer will see them both as "generator power" and add to whichever system is most convenient.

By door opener I mean ADA required door operators ... which are generally interconnected with the security door lock system. As long as things fail "open" and the handicap have assistance it's not that big of an issue. But I'm not sure I trust the door hardware supplier that much!

I never thought about the difference in costs of keeping the Optional Standby wiring separate from standard wiring. I'll have to explore this issue and see if we can get that clarified on the drawings and/or in the specifications!

Thanks guys!

 

[steve66]

I disagree with you guys.

I agree it's a good idea to have some other areas on the Emergency system. The Code is specific in saying "Transfer equipment shall supply only emergency loads"

If it is not in the local building code, it does not go on the emergency transfer switch.

There is no such requirement in Article 702. So my advice to designers when this comes up, is to put lighting of selected areas such as electric rooms and bathrooms on the Legally required transfer system.

Are you saying that selected fixtures in the electrcial rooom can not be put on the emergency system? Surely not?

I think selected fixtures in electrical rooms can be placed on the emergency system. After all, people may have to egress from the electrical room, so it becomes part of the emergency lighting requirements.

As the building designer, I have always decided which fixtures are necessary for safe egress. I've had inspectors and code reviewers tell me to add more emergency fixtures, but I've never had anyone force me to leave an area dark.

Steve

 

[north star]

`
Sandsnow,

Check Section 1007.1 & 1007.2 in the `06 IBC for illumination in the Accessible restrooms.
"Accessible spaces shall be provided with not less than one accessible means of egress".
To have an accessible means of egress, you gotta have an approved means to
light the travel path, even out of a restroom. See Section 1006.1 in the `06 IBC for Means
of Illumination. If it goes completely dark in a restroom, it could pose a hazard ( an increase
in time navigating out of said spaces ) trying to exit out.

Besides, would you want your dear old momma ( or children ) trying to end their activities
and pulling their drawers up, and get out of a completely dark restroom, all the while
doing this from a wheel chair or on crutches?

`

 

[raider1]

`
Sandsnow,

Check Section 1007.1 & 1007.2 in the `06 IBC for illumination in the Accessible restrooms.
"Accessible spaces shall be provided with not less than one accessible means of egress".
To have an accessible means of egress, you gotta have an approved means to
light the travel path, even out of a restroom. See Section 1006.1 in the `06 IBC for Means
of Illumination. If it goes completely dark in a restroom, it could pose a hazard ( an increase
in time navigating out of said spaces ) trying to exit out.

Besides, would you want your dear old momma ( or children ) trying to end their activities
and pulling their drawers up, and get out of a completely dark restroom, all the while
doing this from a wheel chair or on crutches?

`

Sections 1007.1 and 1007.2 do not contain requirements for emergency illumination. The requirements for emergency illumination come from section 1006.3. There is nothing in 1006.3 that would require accessible restrooms to be equipped with emergency illumination unless the restroom had an occupant load of 50 or more people.

It may be a good design to provide optional standby lighting in an accessible restroom, but it is not required.

Chris

 

[raider1]

Are you saying that selected fixtures in the electrcial rooom can not be put on the emergency system? Surely not?

I think selected fixtures in electrical rooms can be placed on the emergency system. After all, people may have to egress from the electrical room, so it becomes part of the emergency lighting requirements.

As the building designer, I have always decided which fixtures are necessary for safe egress. I've had inspectors and code reviewers tell me to add more emergency fixtures, but I've never had anyone force me to leave an area dark.

Steve

Unless the electrical room required emergency lighting, you could not just choose to put the electrical room lighting on an energency lighting circuit.

Chris

 

[north star]

`

Chris,

I will respectfully disagree with your interpretation of Section 1007.1.
As I understand this section, if an Accessible space is included in the
space / building, then a compliant means of exiting that space must be
provided. Section 1007.1 - Accessible spaces ( i.e. - the Accessible
restroom ) shall be provided with not less than one accessible means
of egress. Section 1006.1 - The means of egress shall be illuminated at
all times the building space served by the means of egress is occupied.

I would interpret these two sections to work together to require means
of illumination in the Accessible restroom, ... the exit path out of the
Accessible restroom.

`

 

[raider1]

`

Chris,

I will respectfully disagree with your interpretation of Section 1007.1.
As I understand this section, if an Accessible space is included in the
space / building, then a compliant means of exiting that space must be
provided. Section 1007.1 - Accessible spaces ( i.e. - the Accessible
restroom ) shall be provided with not less than one accessible means
of egress. Section 1006.1 - The means of egress shall be illuminated at
all times the building space served by the means of egress is occupied.

I would interpret these two sections to work together to require means
of illumination in the Accessible restroom, ... the exit path out of the
Accessible restroom.

`

1006.1 requires general illumination for means of egress not emergency illumination. The requirements for emergency illumination come from 1006.3

1006.3 lists 5 areas that require emergency powered illumination:

1. Aisles and unenclosed egress stairways in rooms and spaces that require two or more means of egress.

2. Corridors, exit enclosures and exit passageways in buildings required to have two or more exits.

3. Exterior egress components at other than the level of exit discharge until exit discharge is accomplished for buildings required to have two or more exits.

4. Interior exit discharge elements, as permitted in Section 1024.1, in buildings required to have two or more exits.

5. Exterior landings, as required by section 1008.1.5, for exit discharge doorways in buildings required to have two or more exits.

Chris

 

[iwire]

Unless the electrical room required emergency lighting, you could not just choose to put the electrical room lighting on an emergency lighting circuit.

I agree with Chris, 700.15 spells it out. I guess we could argue who gets to specify a fixture is required for emergency use, I believe that would be the AHJ.

 

[raider1]

I guess we could argue who gets to specify a fixture is required for emergency use, I believe that would be the AHJ.

IBC Section 1006.3 specifies what areas require emergency powered illumination.

The question in my mind would be how many fixtures in those areas are required/permitted to be installed on the emergency circuit.

Chris

 

[sandsnow]

1006.1 requires general illumination for means of egress not emergency illumination. The requirements for emergency illumination come from 1006.3

1006.3 lists 5 areas that require emergency powered illumination:

1. Aisles and unenclosed egress stairways in rooms and spaces that require two or more means of egress.

2. Corridors, exit enclosures and exit passageways in buildings required to have two or more exits.

3. Exterior egress components at other than the level of exit discharge until exit discharge is accomplished for buildings required to have two or more exits.

4. Interior exit discharge elements, as permitted in Section 1024.1, in buildings required to have two or more exits.

5. Exterior landings, as required by section 1008.1.5, for exit discharge doorways in buildings required to have two or more exits.

Chris

It could be argued that in item one of the above list that an electric rooms requiring two doors would apply. I'll concede that.

In knowing all the requirements I cannot permit anything that is not specifically called out in the Building Code or Local Ordinace to be on the Emergency transfer switch.

Of course I wouldn't want my mom to be left in total darkness, but I doubt that defense would hold up in court.

Lobby your AHJ to put it in writing that bathroom or electrical room lighting is required. If I were a designer, a written correction to that effect would probably be satisfactory. I am not a legal expert though.