Enduring the NEC

[ryan_618]

Re: Enduring the NEC

I have to agree for, the most part, with Physis. The code itself is a good code. I learned the NEC as an electrician and through schooling. Once I became an inspector and got exposure to other codes, however, I learned just how incredibly frustating the NEC really is. Every other code in the world is fairly simple to use, and in comparison with those codes, the NEC is not.

 

[charlie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Every other code in the world is fairly simple to use, and in comparison with those codes, the NEC is not.

Ryan, that is why we have a usability task group. We are trying to make it more simple and logical to use. The problem is that this is a more difficult subject to cover.

 

[bennie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

This is like the old story about military cooks. They have to stick to the recipe in order to make food always crappy tasting. Should the food taste good accidently everyone will expect it all time.

I believe the confusion is planned to prevent a simple understanding of an issue, to avoid simplifying the entire text.

 

[bphgravity]

Re: Enduring the NEC

I dont believe the overall confusion with the code is a planned confusion. I believe it is an overall lack of interest of the common electrician to learn anything more than whay they must to get their particular job completed.

When I was first learning to play guitar, I was convinced that the effort was fruitless and a complete waste of time. It was simply too much effort to study notation and practice cords. All I was interested in was actually being able to play a song or something recognizable.

Through dedication and getting over the hump of what seemed tedius and boring wastes of time and effort has produced what is now an effortless and easy process.

You can not become good at anything without putting in the time. I dont care how gifted and talented you may be.

As stated by Thomas Alva Edison, "Genius is 10% thought and 90% perspiration."

 

[karl riley]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Whoever objects to the wording in the Code, try this: take an article or paragraph that you think is written in a confusing way. Re-write it in a non-confusing way. Post it on this forum, and see what comments you get.

If it survives the comments, submit it to the 2005 Code Panel!
Karl

 

[bennie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Karl: 250.70 Rewrite... Use listed clamp or cad-weld to connect ground or bond wire to electrode.

The existing section takes up 12 square inches of the page. The rewrite takes up 2 inches.

 

[bill addiss]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Whoever objects to the wording in the Code, try this: take an article or paragraph that you think is written in a confusing way. Re-write it in a non-confusing way. Post it on this forum, and see what comments you get.

I think Karl has a great idea there.

Bennie,

Shouldn't you make sure the the clamp is listed for (non-detrimental) contact with the specific type of Electrode and the conditions they will be exposed to? ie Direct Burial?

Bill

 

[bennie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Bill: Sure there can be a bit more, but a grocery list is not necessary the way the section is written at the present time. Surely a more universal clamp can be manufactured.
The Erico clamp looks like it is possible.
All the section needs to state is the obvious...use according to listing instructions.

[ June 20, 2003, 11:42 PM: Message edited by: bennie ]

 

[charlie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Karl, great idea! Bennie, make sure your wording doesn't write someone out of business. Your rewrite could demand someone completly re-tool and cause a restraint of trade suit (not likely in this instance but something that has to be kept in mind).

 

[physis]

Re: Enduring the NEC

I remember a time, not all that long ago, when I had nothing but disdain for the NEC.

I still beleive it's in need of significant revision. But after getting to know it better, I don't mind it so much.

I didn't know a thing a year and a half ago. And I have to say that this site played a huge role in my getting up to speed on the NEC!

Anyway, I dug up this this thread to illustrate just that.

 

[electrofelon]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Interesting thread, I also feel that the code is not very user friendly. Reading the codebook is often like trying to swim through a pool of molasses in january. For example, today i was trying to find the section which states that panels can not be located near combustible materials ('like clothes closets'). I searched and searched, knowing that it was in there because i had read it before. OK, the topic is permitted location for a panelboard, so naturally i look under article 408, switchboards and panelboards. I read over the whole section several times, convinced that i have missed it. Finally I by some miracle find it under article 240, location of overcurrent protection in premises. I could use one of those code courses i hear about where they dont teach you code, they teach you how to navigate the codebook!

Ethan.

 

[kentirwin]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Ethan - when beginning my apprenticeship that's exactly how my first instructor described it. "No one can teach the whole NEC and expect you to retain it. I'm going teach you HOW TO USE the code book and find what you need to find."

 

[charlie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Speaking about an interesting thread. There are also posts from Bennie Palmer and Glenn Ziesness (gwz2) who have both passed away.

Bennie is still on the list as having the 2nd highest number of posts with 3181, Glenn had 323 posts. Yes, I still miss both of them.

 

[jwelectric]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Thank you Sam this is a great thread. It brings back memories from years gone by.

 

[allenwayne]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Wait a minute i thought duct tape had a 4 hour fire rating

 

[physis]

Re: Enduring the NEC

I think Bennie hated the code more than me.

 

[charlie]

Re: Enduring the NEC

Bennie marched to a different drummer. He would quote something out of his theory and it would sound like Code. He was a bit confusing to apprentices and those who were not really knowledgeable of the Code. I liked to spar with him but he was in left field a lot of the time.

 

[physis]

Re: Enduring the NEC

He was a bit confusing to apprentices and those who were not really knowledgeable of the Code

I think Bennie might have said you got the cart in front of the horse there.