ENFORCEMENT - Building Codes

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mtnelect

mtnelect

HVAC & Electrical Contractor
Location
Southern California
Occupation
Contractor, C10 & C20 - Semi Retired
No matter where you are located ... The enforcement of building codes is very difficult. Itis called due process. A contractor violates a building code, so what ! The local jurisdiction is overwhelmed with violation., and they don't have the ability to prosecute.

You say file on the contractor's bond. In California, it's $25,000. The bonding companies are not going to release payments.
 
Around here most building departments are under staffed. The fees that they get from permits although they're often very high they aren't enough to hire the needed number of staff. Then you have the taxpayers complaining about their exorbitant property taxes and they don't want to spend more on the building department. I recently paid $181 for a permit to replace a hot water heater which is ridiculous.
 
infinity said:
Around here most building departments are under staffed. The fees that they get from permits although they're often very high they aren't enough to hire the needed number of staff. Then you have the taxpayers complaining about their exorbitant property taxes and they don't want to spend more on the building department. I recently paid $181 for a permit to replace a hot water heater which is ridiculous.
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And I wonder if that $181 actually paid for all the time of everyone involved in the process, let alone hire more people.
 
ptonsparky said:
And I wonder if that $181 actually paid for all the time of everyone involved in the process, let alone hire more people.
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Probably not which translates to needing tax dollars to keep the department running and nobody likes more taxes.
 
It’s enough, it’s just overpaid ill performance government.
We have a third party inspection group they make money off inspections.
They reasonably charge compared to county. County is three time the cost almost.
The old inspector that retired, once one of the founders he sold his stock and bought another home.
They make money just like every government entity they just waist it.
when inspections are reasonable then more people file permits. When they cost out the ^6*8 that’s when you save a buck
 
I think the biggest problem is who did it. You could just make the owner pay, which may encourage them to hire contractors who get inspections. But when most people see what this would cost, and that most inspections are very superficial, there would be revolt.

Most people dont know what needs a permit, and assume the contractor would get one if required. Some may think they are optional because contractor's seem to offer that around here. Not legal, but it is done.
 
infinity said:
Around here most building departments are under staffed. The fees that they get from permits although they're often very high they aren't enough to hire the needed number of staff. Then you have the taxpayers complaining about their exorbitant property taxes and they don't want to spend more on the building department. I recently paid $181 for a permit to replace a hot water heater which is ridiculous.
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The fees are usually enough to fund the departments, it's just that the towns are using the building department as a cash cow, in contravention of the law.
 
mtnelect said:
No matter where you are located ... The enforcement of building codes is very difficult. Itis called due process. A contractor violates a building code, so what ! The local jurisdiction is overwhelmed with violation., and they don't have the ability to prosecute.

You say file on the contractor's bond. In California, it's $25,000. The bonding companies are not going to release payments.
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Maybe 7 years ago Philly gave a demolition permit to a unqualified contractor who had a pot head demoing a 3 story billing while people were in the old building attached to it. Building next store collapsed killing several people and of course law suites were started. Because of the cities poorly run L & I they now require all electricians , plumbers , HVAC and others to take an OSHA 10 class of. ( OSHA 30 if a boss ). They also require electricians to prove proof of vehicle insurance every year while renewing the $165 electrical license. In all my years never saw a sparky performing electrical work while driving.
 
garbo said:
Maybe 7 years ago Philly gave a demolition permit to a unqualified contractor who had a pot head demoing a 3 story billing while people were in the old building attached to it. Building next store collapsed killing several people and of course law suites were started. Because of the cities poorly run L & I they now require all electricians , plumbers , HVAC and others to take an OSHA 10 class of. ( OSHA 30 if a boss ). They also require electricians to prove proof of vehicle insurance every year while renewing the $165 electrical license. In all my years never saw a sparky performing electrical work while driving.
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NJ requires electrical contractors to carry a $300,000 combined policy for property and bodily damage insurance. I think my company carries between 3 and 5 million combined.
 
gadfly56 said:
The fees are usually enough to fund the departments, it's just that the towns are using the building department as a cash cow, in contravention of the law.
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Dukes of hazard PA still does not have the state electrical license they have been working on since 1964 so it can be a hassle obtaining a license for different townships. Some townships do not recognize other locations electrical license so you have to take a 4 hour test to get their license. I had two co-workers pre pandemic pass the Philly 4 hour test on first attempt but took first guy took 11 months & 6 visits to center city Municipal Services building and second guy at least 5 months to finally have them issue an electrical license. Worst part second guy lost a 5K job because he could not pull a permit before finally receiving his license.
 
garbo said:
Dukes of hazard PA still does not have the state electrical license they have been working on since 1964 so it can be a hassle obtaining a license for different townships. Some townships do not recognize other locations electrical license so you have to take a 4 hour test to get their license. I had two co-workers pre pandemic pass the Philly 4 hour test on first attempt but took first guy took 11 months & 6 visits to center city Municipal Services building and second guy at least 5 months to finally have them issue an electrical license. Worst part second guy lost a 5K job because he could not pull a permit before finally receiving his license.
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When NJ is ahead of the pack, it's time to worry. One license, statewide.
 
garbo said:
Dukes of hazard PA still does not have the state electrical license they have been working on since 1964 so it can be a hassle obtaining a license for different townships. Some townships do not recognize other locations electrical license so you have to take a 4 hour test to get their license. I had two co-workers pre pandemic pass the Philly 4 hour test on first attempt but took first guy took 11 months & 6 visits to center city Municipal Services building and second guy at least 5 months to finally have them issue an electrical license. Worst part second guy lost a 5K job because he could not pull a permit before finally receiving his license.
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When I hear horror stories like this I'm glad that here in NJ we have a statewide license and no local rules or amendments. This sounds more like our other neighboring state New York where their entire system is totally corrupt.
 
coffeebean said:
Do you take into account when an inspector has to do a re-inspection because there is a violation?
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In NJ it does not matter. One inspection, ten inspections, same original fee. However, if you are up to number three or four, the sweat is going to start rolling into your eyes, because the inspector is likely to find a way to share his annoyance.
 
coffeebean said:
I would like to take all the contractors on here who consistently bad mouth Electrical Inspectors out with me for one day of inspections.
You can experience the lack of knowledge, poor craftsmanship, lying and shenanigans that goes on daily.
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I've heard many stories at inspector CEU seminars mentioning exactly what you've said. Contractors who sign permits and never set foot on the site let alone supervise the unskilled laborers who are doing the work.
 
infinity said:
I've heard many stories at inspector CEU seminars mentioning exactly what you've said. Contractors who sign permits and never set foot on the site let alone supervise the unskilled laborers who are doing the work.
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Rough inspection, failed miserably. I call the contractor on record, he responded "yeah, I hear my guy messed up". So, I'm like ok, let's see how long this clown will hang on to this lie. By the fifth failure he reversed course and backed out playing the I wasn't getting paid card.
 
coffeebean said:
Then we have the homeowners who fire the contractor after the rough has passed and do a change of contractor to "self" and hire a handyman to do the finish work.
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Yeah as good as the statewide system is there is room for improvement. Talk to any inspector who's been hitting the pavement for a while and you'll hear the horror stories. Not sure what the solution is but I think that it probably has to start at the top with the DCA.
 
In California the CSLB requires a $25,000 bond. But for the consumers the bonding companies say sue us.
 
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