Equipotential Bonding

[LarryFine]

If it is continuously wet, it has the same safety hazards as a swimming pool that the equipotential bonding of a pool supposedly makes safe.

Swimming isn't the big difference?

 

[petersonra]

Swimming isn't the big difference?

How is wading any less hazardous electrically than swimming?

 

[LarryFine]

How is wading any less hazardous electrically than swimming?

Tall rubber boots vs submersion with exposed skin?

 

[rc/retired]

I all due respect to rc/ retired, read last sentence in the original post. #1.. That given in explanation, you know as much as I do..

Not to worry
IMO the OP's post is kind of vague to me anyway. I believe he's asking a hypothetical question.
If I'm reading 682.33 correctly, the EP is required around the service. Is that correct?
Ron

 

[kwired]

How is a concrete slab in a greenhouse an artificially made body of water?

I'd say it probably is if it is intended to hold water for indefinite period of time.

Dikes around above ground fuel tanks, fertilizer tanks, etc. will hold rain water, but the intended purpose isn't to hold water and it usually will get pumped out when it gets deep enough to justify doing so. So I'd say not a 680 or a 682 application.

If it is continuously wet, it has the same safety hazards as a swimming pool that the equipotential bonding of a pool supposedly makes safe. I just don't see that the code addresses it for a greenhouse, even though the same hazards exist.

Swimming pool users are commonly totally immersed in the water. Said greenhouse, people normally will not be total or near totally immersed. They might even be wearing rubber boots or other water resistant footwear.

Similar in many food manufacturing facilities, water often everywhere at times, but nobody normally immersed in it.

 

[Dell3c]

Not to worry
IMO the OP's post is kind of vague to me anyway. I believe he's asking a hypothetical question.
If I'm reading 682.33 correctly, the EP is required around the service. Is that correct?
Ron

Quote: shall be installed adjacent to all outdoor service equipment or disconnecting means that control control equipment in or on the water., that have a metallic enclosure and controls accessible to personnel, and are likely to become energized. The equipotential plane shall encompass the area around the equipment and shall extend from the area directly below the equipment out not less than (36in.) in all directions from which a person would be able to stand and come in contact w/ the equipment..

 

[bcorps]

I believe he's asking a hypothetical question.

Sort of hypothetical, but since I'm working on a greenhouse right now, I'm just doing some research and "what-if-ing". This greenhouse has automatic rain sprinklers so yeah, I figure it's going to be wet pretty much 24/7. Personally, I don't care for walking around on concrete without shoes, but greenhouses tend to attract a lot of barefoot, hemp-lover types.

 

[jap]

what if the greenhouse is growing water lilies and there is 16 inches of water all the time?

what if there are goldfish?

just curious how close it has to get to being a pool before it needs bonding.

With water lilies and goldfish you've just described what some may consider a "decorative pool"

On the other hand some may think water lilies are ugly , or, may have had a bad experience with a goldfish in their past so it would be appear this rule may be open to interpretation.

680.1 Scope. The provisions of this article apply to the
construction and installation of electrical wiring for, and equipment
in or adjacent to, all swimming, wading, therapeutic, and
decorative pools;

JAP>

 

[rc/retired]

Personally, I don't care for walking around on concrete without shoes, but greenhouses tend to attract a lot of barefoot, hemp-lover types.

That made me laugh. As an inspector, I would not require an equipotential bonding grid in a greenhouse unless the NEC required it.
Good luck.

Ron

 

[Dell3c]

There is no pool (post#1)... This entire question posed, was completely hypothetical in nature, from the start to finish. So my bad..

(no black & white involved.. just total gray)

Have a wonderful day..

 

[kwired]

Equipotential bonding for pools is primarily in 680 part II - permanently installed pools section.

Fountains is part V. Portable self contained fountains are not covered by part V - it refers you to parts of art 422 for rules on those.

I see no equipotential bonding rules in part V.

Equipotential plane is mentioned in 682. What you might find in a greenhouse probably isn't a 682 application, but even so seems to only be required around service equipment or equipment that is controlling whatever is in the water.

 

[Fred B]

There are 9 steps to clean Timberland boots with soap and water. Step 1: Mix the dishwashing soap and warm water. Step 1: Mix the dishwashing soap and warm water. Step 3: Remove the shoelaces and insoles. Step 4: Wash the shoelaces. Step 5: Clean the insoles. Step 6: Scrub the Timberland boots. Step 7: Clean the outsoles. Step 8: Wipe using the microfibre cloth. Step 9: Air dry for 24 hours.

Dish soap or oil soap? Dish soap will strip the natural oils in the leather.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

If a swimming pool needs equipotential bonding, it would not be a big jump to require it anywhere there is standing water, and for the same reasons.

I just don't see that it is a code requirement.

There is a huge in the effects of electric shock when you are completely immersed in the water, or are just standing in the water.

 

[acrwc10]

Anyone ever have an AHJ require equipotential bonding in a greenhouse? I have my doubts, but it is a big slab of concrete with electric fans, pumps, etc. Consider it an extremely shallow pool.

I doubt many people have drown in "an extremely shallow" puddle on a slab floor, but once you are completely on the slab, not one foot inside and one foot outside, there wouldn't be much hazard from neutral earth voltage or similar issues.

 

[Tulsa Electrician]

Ok, what if?
If the slab is not poured trow in 20' of #4. Then send him the bill.
Detached building with a feeder?
Two birds one stone!

 

[Tulsa Electrician]

I can see it now every time a house has a water sprinkler system with a posted plant on the porch would require a EQB

 

[ActionDave]

Ok, what if?
If the slab is not poured trow in 20' of #4. Then send him the bill.
Detached building with a feeder?
Two birds one stone!

The birds would live for another day. A concrete slab does not meet the requirement for a concrete encased electrode.