Every Sconce Light install ever is WRONG?

[Irving LaRue]

I installed all these sconce lights in a courthouse in Northern Virginia. The inspector failed them because I grounded the cover plate with the fixture ground wire. He said I needed to use a 12 gauge jumper because the circuit used 12 gauge MC into the box.

His logic was that the code required a “full” size ground and it needs to match the size of the circuit to be considered full. Unfortunately, it’s a custom order fixture that doesn’t have an installation manual to prove me right or wrong.

To me and my foreman, this seemed absurd. Am I wrong here?

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Is the box in the wall metal? If so the green wire needs to connect to the box. The fixture adapter will be grounded by the metal screws and connecting the EGC from the listed fixture to the adapter is all you need to do, to comply with the code.

 

[infinity]

I agree with Don, you don't even need to connect the stranded EGC from the fixture so the inspector is wrong.

 

[ptonsparky]

I would have wrapped the 12 EG on the fixture bar screw myself, but then I would have run the white & black thru the same hole for fear of inductive heating.



IMO, neither is worth doing it all over, nor the paper and ink used for the correction order.

 

[Irving LaRue]

Is the box in the wall metal? If so the green wire needs to connect to the box. The fixture adapter will be grounded by the metal screws and connecting the EGC from the listed fixture to the adapter is all you need to do, to comply with the code.

The box is metal. 1900 box with a single gang device ring. Fixture wire is wrapped around the device plate then tied together underneath a wire nut with the ground wire connected to the 1900 box and a ground wire from the MC cable.

 

[LarryFine]

So the inspector believes that the thin wire is adequate to bond the fixture itself, with active electrical components and exposed to touch, but not adequate to bond the mounting plate, solidly screwed to the box, that nobody will ever see or touch?


Ridiculous!

 

[hillbilly1]

If the mounting plate was furnished with fixture, I would say it’s a listed assembly, and would be part of that assembly.

 

[qcroanoke]

I would have run the white & black thru the same hole for fear of inductive heating.

Pretty sure you're being facetious here.....

 

[ptonsparky]

Pretty sure you're being facetious here.....

a tad

 

[qcroanoke]

Unfortunately, it’s a custom order fixture that doesn’t have an installation manual to prove me right or wrong.

To me and my foreman, this seemed absurd. Am I wrong here?



View attachment 2567195

Having no installation instructions or manual to look at maybe you should weigh how much it's worth to you and your customer to push this with the inspector.
Those UL and CSA labels may have him looking at them.
Although I know nothing about those listings.

 

[LarryFine]

If you end up having to do it, I would suggest adding bare pigtails instead of looping the EGC.

It'll be easier, faster, you won't need to strip wire, and you can pre-make them ahead of time.

 

[jmellc]

Inspector is another little nazi with an overinflated ego.

 

[suemarkp]

If by cover plate you mean that square part of the light fixture, 250.122 says that ground wires dont have to be larger than the supply conductors. So if those little fixture wires are all 16 or 18 gauge, that should be sufficient if the green EGC is the same.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I would have wrapped the 12 EG on the fixture bar screw myself, but then I would have run the white & black thru the same hole for fear of inductive heating.



IMO, neither is worth doing it all over, nor the paper and ink used for the correction order.

There is no current on the EGC under normal conditions so no inductive heating, however the EGC is required to connect to the box and just connecting it to the fixture bar would be a violation.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

If by cover plate you mean that square part of the light fixture, 250.122 says that ground wires dont have to be larger than the supply conductors. So if those little fixture wires are all 16 or 18 gauge, that should be sufficient if the green EGC is the same.

I don't even think you have to look at the code for the fixture EGC size...it is a listed product and that wire is outside the scope of the code.

 

[Irving LaRue]

If by cover plate you mean that square part of the light fixture, 250.122 says that ground wires dont have to be larger than the supply conductors. So if those little fixture wires are all 16 or 18 gauge, that should be sufficient if the green EGC is the same.

Not the cover plate, square portion of the light. The metal mounting plate that screws into the junction box to support the face of the fixture. The place where the EGC is currently wrapped around the grounding screw.

 

[Irving LaRue]

I would have wrapped the 12 EG on the fixture bar screw myself, but then I would have run the white & black thru the same hole for fear of inductive heating.



IMO, neither is worth doing it all over, nor the paper and ink used for the correction order.

I don’t understand the inductive heating comment. Can you explain that to me?

 

[Irving LaRue]

Having no installation instructions or manual to look at maybe you should weigh how much it's worth to you and your customer to push this with the inspector.
Those UL and CSA labels may have him looking at them.
Although I know nothing about those listings.

Unfortunately that’s the decision we had to make. It was less than 1 days labor for 2 apprentices to take down all the sconce lights in the building and add a grounding pigtail. The inspector has generally been good to us, but he has his little vandetta against wrapping screws on the mounting plate. Ultimately, the AHJ has all the power and we have to pick our battles. Here’s a picture of the final product:

 

[infinity]

. The inspector has generally been good to us, but he has his little vandetta against wrapping screws on the mounting plate.

He's an idiot. That what I call inspectors who make up their own code rules.

 

[ptonsparky]

I don’t understand the inductive heating comment. Can you explain that to me?

Typically all the conductors of a circuit run through the same knockout or conduit. Metallic raceway and enclosures. HIGH currents can cause heating .

Your inspector was being so picky, I just threw that in.