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exam question

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jcgjupiter

Member
Re: exam question

Thanks everyone for helping. Concerning my original question I have come to the conclusion that I have to include the 12 amp fridge and the 1500 watt microwave, because in the "Stallcup's" books, published by the NFPA they have some example commercial load calcs, that include things like this even after including 180 va for all receptacles.
From that I feel like on a test question I should include them. I failed the test the first time by one question too many. I plan to take it again next week. Johnny
 
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bphgravity

Senior Member
Location
Florida
Re: exam question

Let me propose a hypothetical question: What if the other tenant decides to buy a 12-ampere refrigerator and 1500-watt microwave after they move in? Not only that, they buy a 1000-watt toaster, 2000-watt floor heater, and a 800-watt trash compactor, etc... None of these things were added into the original service calc.

These are all general purpose loads that can be added, removed, and relocated at anytime and for any reason which is completely and totaly out of the control of the electrical installer.

I still feel the loads are not required to be added and can be dismissed as general purpose loads already calculated in the lighting and receptacle outlet loads. None of the Mike Holt nor any of the Tom Henry references I own show these "extras" added in. :)

P.S. Does the exam you took that had this question provide a review service or answer sheet of some kind?
 
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luke warmwater

Senior Member
Re: exam question

Originally posted by bphgravity:
Originally posted by jcgjupiter:
A commercial/industrial building with 2 tenants with a single service. What is the total demand on the service.
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What does this question have to do with Dwellings? :roll:
I didn't realize it until I just read your most recent post. Sorry.
I still agree with you, not to count them.
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shaun

Member
Re: exam question

hey guys, this is a lot of stuff to keep up with, so have we found the answer or not? IMO, everyone has validity in their explanations, however which is the correct explanation?
 
charlie b

charlie b

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Lockport, IL
Occupation
Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
Re: exam question

Originally posted by pierre: 220.3(B)(1)Specific Appliances or Loads. An outlet for a specific appliance or other load no covered in (2) through (11) shall be computed based on the ampere rating of the appliance or load served.

Yes you would use these for the calculation.
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I have gone back and re-read this series of posts. I now have to (1) Agree with Pierre, and (2) Apologize to Pierre for having not paid attention to the fact that this is not a dwelling. (Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea culpa. :( )

Yes you count them. The rule cited by Pierre (quoted above) tells us that you count each individual appliance, unless you are dealing with a dwelling, in which case the appliances are part of the 3 VA per square foot. That does not apply to a commercial facility. So you count each appliance.

If someone else moves into that space, and uses different appliances, then they should hire an electrician to make sure that the loading is still acceptable.

[ April 26, 2004, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: charlie b ]
 
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