Failed final: bathroom switch accessability

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deckscrew

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I'm a GC in the Bay Area. I failed a final yesterday because the light switches to the bathroom lights are located behind the doors (there are two entrances to the bathroom, and the lights are on a 3-way switch and motion sensor).

My electrician put the lights in where indicated on the drawings, but the owner had us reverse the swing on the doors due to the doors hitting the vanity and toilet as you enter the bathroom. She did not mind that the switches were now behind the door, especially since the lights were on a motion sensor.

Yesterday the building inspector would not final the job due to the fact that the switches were behind a door when opened and not readily accessible. I asked what code section was he siting and he could not answer. My electrician says he is full of BS and that is not the intent of the code. The owner also is happy with current configuration and does not want to change it.

My question is what is the section of the code that the inspector is referring to and what are your opinions on this matter?

Thanks in advance
 
deckscrew said:
Yesterday the building inspector would not final the job due to the fact that the switches were behind a door when opened and not readily accessible.
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You will have to deal with the building inspector over this. If he was there for the final that means it already passed the electrical inspection.

He may know of some local building code. I would call his boss and get to the bottom of this.
 
My comments come from the NEC so local codes may apply.

There is no requirment in the NEC that a switch can't be installed behind a door. In fact there is no requirment that the switch for a specific room even be in that room. This would be a design issue and outside the scope of the NEC.

Chris
 
Article 100 - Definitions -

Readily Accessible - Capable of being reached quickly for operation, renewal, or inspections without requiring those to whom ready access is requisite to climb over or remove obstacles or to resort to portable ladders, and so forth.

This installation would be readily accessible.
 
When I asked him why he did not pass the inspection he sited "NEC code 400 or something". It kind of upset me that he couldn't site the specific code while failing me.
 
deckscrew said:
When I asked him why he did not pass the inspection he sited "NEC code 400 or something". It kind of upset me that he couldn't site the specific code while failing me.
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404.8 (A) Location.
"All switches and circuit breakers used as switches shall be located so that they may be operated from a readily accessible place."
 
Speciffic code or pass it. We do not get to wire the way we want to sometimes nor does he get to pass only what he wants to. There are many items that I would have laid money on something being in the NEC but had to swallow my pride when I only thought it was in "400 something." He may believe it is there or think it should be, but code reference or CO.
 
Since this is a 3-way switch application, is the other switch "readily accessible" or did both switch locations end up behind a door? I would have a hard time stating that a swing door makes this an issue for switch location. You indicated that there was a motion detector incorporated also. Is this located behind the door that might render it inoperable. I guess I don't see the problem and feel it is a rwal stretch for the "readily accessible" arguement.
 
I think it's a good call. She wanted the doorswing changed SOMEONE should have told her that the switches need to be moved also.
 
Thanks for all the replies. I guess its a vacancy sensor, when you walk in the bathroom the lights turn on automatically and stay on for about ten minutes.

Both switches are behind both doors.

Yes when the owner asked that the door swing be reversed I asked the electrician if there was a problem with having the switches behind the door. He said aside from some inconvenience as long as the switches were accessible there was no problem. He says the accessibility issue comes into question when you have to move or climb over things.

The irony is that that the owner like the configuration, has no trouble gaining access to the switches and gets a kick out of the fact that the lights turn on when she enters the bathroom.
 
I agree that there is nothing in the NEC that says the switches cannot be behind the door. There is nothing that even says that you need a set of 3-ways if you have two doors to a room. There is nothing that says that the switch has to be near the point of entry into the room. If the inspector is relying on the NEC to back up his position he is wrong, wrong, wrong. If it is a local ordinance or local building code, then he may be OK, but it is NOT in the NEC.
 
As others said there is NOTHING in the NEC that says it cannot be behind the door. and if he cannot give you local ordinance, then He is wrong!!

That being said, I learned to 'pick' and 'choose' my battles ;) would it be hard to just temporarily move the swing of the door back the way it was just so you can 'pass' and then put it back (for the owner) after he signs it off??
If this inspector is going to be 'difficult' about this thing (He sounds like a person that seeks revenge because you made him look bad), and I dont know how many jobs you might run into him on, But this sounds like a 'little' battle that I would just let him have(win) assuming the 'door swing' issue is not hard to do. Now in the future, when it comes to 'big battles' then I would definitley say stand your ground and make the inspector give you 'code'.
 
Is it possible to leave that switch and fish a 3 wire cable to a switch facing the hall?? Make a 3 way switch. I believe the inspector is way off base here esp. since the bath lights are on a motion sensor.


Behind a door is readily accessible. Tell the inspector to read the definition of accessible, Readily

capable of being reached quickly for operation, renewal or inspections without requiring those to whom ready access is requisite to climb over or remove obstacles or to resort to portable ladders , and so forth
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I don't think closing a door would be removing an obstacle.
 
This would be a big deal to reverse the door swing. Probably a carpenter's time for a day or two, as well as some patching and painting.

The inspector is a nice guy. A young guy two years out of inspector's school.

The owner wants to leave everything the way it is. The master bath has a marble everywhere and looks great. She really doesn't want anyone to "move, patch and paint" anything. She asked me to fight the correction notice. She suggested I make her the bad guy.

Thanks for that sketch and all the other information
 
If push comes to shove could you relocate the switch behind the other one on the wall outside the bath? If nothing more than to pass CO and remove later.
 
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