Fire pump and jockey pump

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hhsting

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Glen bunie, md, us
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I have new incoming #1/0 service lateral conductors that comes into meter than to wireway trough in fire pump room. The #1/0 are tapped in the wireway trough with #12 to jockey pump controller disconnect to jockey pump. #1/0 then continue to fire pump controller disconnect to fire pump. My question is does NEC 2014 allow the tap to jockey pump?

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If you don't have a disconnect, than it's not a feeder and can't be tapped.

I don't see anything in 695 allowing a tap like you described

without more info on how the service is set up, i'd say it's a violation

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Attached is description of whole diagram.
f098f5694fcd87a345d670369a884561.jpg
 
I misunderstood from your description. I think you will be ok with this set up. You have to use #8 instead of the #12. Just check 230.46 to make sure everything else is good

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hhsting said:
I have new incoming #1/0 service lateral conductors that comes into meter than to wireway trough in fire pump room. The #1/0 are tapped in the wireway trough with #12 to jockey pump controller disconnect to jockey pump. #1/0 then continue to fire pump controller disconnect to fire pump. My question is does NEC 2014 allow the tap to jockey pump?

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Yes, you can do this. But keep in mind the wireway will have to meet 695.6(I). Also, the jockey controller will have to be service rated. A separate branch circuit from a nearby panel is much simpler and cheaper as this does not need to be a reliable source
 
hhsting said:
CT and meter are inside room but service lateral conductors are 2 inch of concrete under the building. They come up in the room go to meter and CT.

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Then the service conductors are inside the building and have to be protected in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2) per 695.6(A)(1) IMO.
 
packersparky said:
Then the service conductors are inside the building and have to be protected in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2) per 695.6(A)(1) IMO.
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No, the service conductors are in the fire pump room. That is allowed.
I do wonder, however, about the CT can and meter in the fire pump room. Never seen it done and can't imagine any POCO allowing their meter in a locked fire pump room.
 
packersparky said:
Then the service conductors are inside the building and have to be protected in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2) per 695.6(A)(1) IMO.
Click to expand...
The Ct, meter, wireway and two service disconnects, fire pump and jockey pump are in same room that has 2 hour fire wall rating. Are you saying conductor that comes up from underground to service disconnect in room has to comply NEC 230.6 which is less than 10 feet?
 
texie said:
No, the service conductors are in the fire pump room. That is allowed.
I do wonder, however, about the CT can and meter in the fire pump room. Never seen it done and can't imagine any POCO allowing their meter in a locked fire pump room.
Click to expand...

Where is that allowed? 695.6(A)(1) is pretty clear IMO. Service conductors inside of a building have to be protected in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2).
 
packersparky said:
Where is that allowed? 695.6(A)(1) is pretty clear IMO. Service conductors inside of a building have to be protected in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2).
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When you enter the fire pump room it is essentially a separate building as a fire pump room has a 2 hour fire rating and must be accessible from outside the protected premises per NFPA 20.
 
texie said:
When you enter the fire pump room it is essentially a separate building as a fire pump room has a 2 hour fire rating and must be accessible from outside the protected premises per NFPA 20.
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The building codes that I am aware of require 3 hour separation in order to be considered a separate building. Even if it is considered a separate building, it still is inside of a building, and would have to be kept outside of the building per 695.6(A)(1) or installed in the building in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2).
 
packersparky said:
The building codes that I am aware of require 3 hour separation in order to be considered a separate building. Even if it is considered a separate building, it still is inside of a building, and would have to be kept outside of the building per 695.6(A)(1) or installed in the building in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2).
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How can the wireway, CT be in 2 inch concrete or brick wall with tap and comply with 230.6?
 
texie said:
When you enter the fire pump room it is essentially a separate building as a fire pump room has a 2 hour fire rating and must be accessible from outside the protected premises per NFPA 20.
Click to expand...
Where in NFPA 20 this is being said?

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packersparky said:
Where is that allowed? 695.6(A)(1) is pretty clear IMO. Service conductors inside of a building have to be protected in accordance with 230.6(1) or (2).
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695.6 Power Wiring
​
(A) Supply Conductors
...
​
(2) Feeders
...
Exception to (A)(2)(d): The supply conductors located in
the electrical equipment room where they originate and in
the fire pump room shall not be required to have the mini-
mum 2-hour fire separation or fire resistance rating, unless
otherwise required by 700.10(D) of this Code.

Any questions?
 
gadfly56 said:
695.6 Power Wiring(A) Supply Conductors
...(2) Feeders
...
Exception to (A)(2)(d): The supply conductors located in
the electrical equipment room where they originate and in
the fire pump room shall not be required to have the mini-
mum 2-hour fire separation or fire resistance rating, unless
otherwise required by 700.10(D) of this Code.

Any questions?
Click to expand...

These are not feeders. They are service conductors.
 
packersparky said:
These are not feeders. They are service conductors.
Click to expand...
Ok but by your account any service conductors not just fire pump would have to comply 230.6. So if you have any service conductors inside room that go to trough with miltiple service disconnect then by your account need to be in brick or concrete encased. How many times you have seen that in electric room?

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