Fixture chain as EGC

[hbiss]

Doesn't even look like that's the original supply wire. Looks like the zip cord was torn on half.

These fixtures are re-wired every day. If I were you I would plan on taking the top off and re-wiring it.

By the way, that's a real great picture of the fixture all wrapped up in bubble wrap, we can see exactly what it is.

-Hal

 

[Sea Nile]

guessing around 50 to 60lbs, how can you tell it’s not the original chain?

I can't tell for sure, it just looks like a heavy chandelier for that style of chain.

I did a quick search on Home Depot and saw a very similar chain was rated for only 50 lbs.

It may be the original chain if the chandelier is lighter than it looks.

 

[eds]

Doesn't even look like that's the original supply wire. Looks like the zip cord was torn on half.

These fixtures are re-wired every day. If I were you I would plan on taking the top off and re-wiring it.

By the way, that's a real great picture of the fixture all wrapped up in bubble wrap, we can see exactly what it is.

-Hal

Use your imagination, I am not unwrapping it untill I have the i have the job.. I actualy think it is the original fixture wire based on its gauge.

 

[eds]

I can't tell for sure, it just looks like a heavy chandelier for that style of chain.

I did a quick search on Home Depot and saw a very similar chain was rated for only 50 lbs.

It may be the original chain if the chandelier is lighter than it looks.

it may only be 50lbs just using the how hard it is to lift with two arms to estimate the weight

 

[jmellc]

Some jackleg handled it along the way and cut the ground out is what it looks like to me.

 

[Mr. Serious]

The chain looks original to me, based on the fact that it's the same color as the chandelier. Whoever previously installed it probably cut the ground wire instead of connecting it.

I just searched satco.com for "ground wire." They make that 18 bare stranded that the fixture manufacturers use. In the original fixture, it is probably crimped onto an internal-tooth lockwasher held between some nuts on the threaded rod that runs through the center of the fixture. They sell replacement ones like that, as well as just a roll of the bare wire. Two colors, bare copper or tinned copper. If you get the one with the lockwasher crimped onto it, you can choose from a 1/8" IP or 1/4" IP lockwasher. 1/8 IP threaded pipe is the kind used in most fixtures, lamps and chandeliers up to a certain size, but very large heavy ones will use the 1/4 IP size. The actual diameter is of course much larger than 1/8" or 1/4." I might be wrong, but I think this IP size standard comes from gas pipes before there were electric fixtures. The first electric fixtures used some of the same sizes of pipes as the gas lights before them, and today's fixtures still use the same sizes.

 

[norcal]

I might be wrong, but I think this IP size standard comes from gas pipes before there were electric fixtures. The first electric fixtures used some of the same sizes of pipes as the gas lights before them, and today's fixtures still use the same sizes.

There were fittings that capped the gas supply, then also supported the new electric fixture off them, I have a couple of them in my stash.

 

[kwired]

You can buy bare copper 16 awg and thread thru chain
But luminaires have been required to be listed for many years. A listed fixture would have the required egc

Since luminaires are required to be listed said EGC would need to be required in the listing standards and not so much the NEC. NEC would require EGC to be present at the outlet box or in the supply wiring method for luminaires not supplied via an outlet box.

 

[kwired]

How old is this fixture? Much more than 40 years old and I don't think a ground wire run through chains was very common.

 

[hbiss]

Use your imagination, I am not unwrapping it untill I have the i have the job.

I agree, but what kind of customer would ask someone for an estimate when they can't see what they would be installing? The customer should have unwrapped it. There may be parts missing or other problems with that fixture that you won't find out about until after you gave them a price and got the job. Then too, suppose you break something while unwrapping it? Now try to get paid.

-Hal

 

[hbiss]

These guys have EVERYTHING you might need for fixtures and lamps. Here's their wire section.

https://grandbrass.com/wire-cord-sets/

-Hal

 

[GoldDigger]

The way the bottom link of the chain is separated at the ends indicates to me that either it is not the original chain or that link was opened to shorten the chain.
Many DIYers do not know to open the link by twisting sideways instead of spreading it.
A non-welded link chain is probably OK for a 60# fixture, but I still do not like the look of it.
For a 60# fixture a copper EGC is probably adequate as a safety wire it the fixture is not dropped very far.

 

[eds]

The way the bottom link of the chain is separated at the ends indicates to me that either it is not the original chain or that link was opened to shorten the chain.
Many DIYers do not know to open the link by twisting sideways instead of spreading it.
A non-welded link chain is probably OK for a 60# fixture, but I still do not like the look of it.
For a 60# fixture a copper EGC is probably adequate as a safety wire it the fixture is not dropped very far.

So the fixture chain pliers I have spread the links apart then squeeze them close. Looks like that’s not the proper way to do it?

 

[hbiss]

I did say they had everything...

https://grandbrass.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000742670-How-to-Correctly-Open-Chain-Links-with-a-Chain-Plier

-Hal

 

[eds]

I did say they had everything...

https://grandbrass.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000742670-How-to-Correctly-Open-Chain-Links-with-a-Chain-Plier

-Hal

Same pliers that I have

 

[Little Bill]

So the fixture chain pliers I have spread the links apart then squeeze them close. Looks like that’s not the proper way to do it?

That's the way to do it, I have a pair of those pliers I use. I used to wrestle the links apart with two pair of regular pliers until I saw the link pliers. You can hardly tell a link has been opened if you do it right with the link pliers.

 

[jmellc]

That's the way to do it, I have a pair of those pliers I use. I used to wrestle the links apart with two pair of regular pliers until I saw the link pliers. You can hardly tell a link has been opened if you do it right with the link pliers.

I have those too. Great tool.

 

[infinity]

So the fixture chain pliers I have spread the links apart then squeeze them close. Looks like that’s not the proper way to do it?

I've been using them for over 35 years there is nothing wrong with that method.

 

[eds]

My response on the chains pliers, was based on a previous post that twisting the link open was the preferred method.

 

[infinity]

My response on the chains pliers, was based on a previous post that twisting the link open was the preferred method.

IMO it's not the preferred method but opinions may vary.