Fixture without box behind

[Yoandrys]

I found several vanity fixture without box on the wall, when I ask to about it, the answers was that is not mandatory in electrical code. So that statement filled me with doubts, I have tried to search the code, but did not find an exact answer, please, any reference that you can give me?

 

[Fred B]

I found several vanity fixture without box on the wall, when I ask to about it, the answers was that is not mandatory in electrical code. So that statement filled me with doubts, I have tried to search the code, but did not find an exact answer, please, any reference that you can give me?

The answer that it not mandatory isn't exactly correct. There are vanity fixtures, as well as other light fixtures that are allowed to wire directly into the fixture. It has a KO and you attach a box connector and the fixture meets the requirements of an enclosure and you make up the connections inside the fixture, but you have to have the cable connector installed. Consider the 4ft flourecent fixture, no box just the cable connectors.

 

[ptonsparky]

Thinking of all the wall and ceiling mount fixtures I've seen where the fixture wires extend well past any box, I have wondered how important those boxes are.

 

[Fred B]

Thinking of all the wall and ceiling mount fixtures I've seen where the fixture wires extend well past any box, I have wondered how important those boxes are.

The domed part of the fixture is listed as an extension of the box that adds to the ci of the box. To put one of those on without the box is a violation.

 

[ptonsparky]

The domed part of the fixture is listed as an extension of the box that adds to the ci of the box. To put one of those on without the box is a violation.

Yes, I realize that. Now look at that 12" fixture that overlaps the required box by 4" on all sides. See those fixture wires that run out to the lamp holders? Is there a box behind them? Anything besides sheetrock?

 

[KDough]

Depending on what type of fixture we are talking about it may or may not be Ok to not have a box. After all a fixture , like a surface mounted garage type fixture is just a large j-box with some LED's. However if you are talking about a canopy type fixture where the canopy is duel purpose, 10 to support the fixture and 2) to cover the J-box. Then you defiantly need a box to make your splices. In the case above that ptonsparky mentions , I think if you look at 314.25(B) give guidance on what should be done in that situation.

 

[infinity]

Yes, I realize that. Now look at that 12" fixture that overlaps the required box by 4" on all sides. See those fixture wires that run out to the lamp holders? Is there a box behind them? Anything besides sheetrock?

I wondered about that too as to how it's acceptable. The wires are pressed up against the ceiling by the insulation on the back of the fixture.

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

I look at it like this. If there is a 7/8" KO to accept a NM/MC/ flex/ conduit connector then more than likely it's good without a box.
If it doesn't then it probably isn't.
It's abused so much by Handy men & Electricians.

 

[Poweranytime]

We find coach lights on fronts of garages all the time without boxes usually added by handyman. But have found it on new house connected to an afci . When we opened water poured out and neutral was crushed.

 

[Poweranytime]

Tapcom right to the block no box

 

[jmellc]

Yes, I realize that. Now look at that 12" fixture that overlaps the required box by 4" on all sides. See those fixture wires that run out to the lamp holders? Is there a box behind them? Anything besides sheetrock?

I’ve seen that on wooden ceilings too.

 

[ptonsparky]

I’ve seen that on wooden ceilings too.

Yes. That does make me cring.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I love removing a receptacle where there is wood paneling and there is no box. The receptacle is screwed to the paneling....

 

[Poweranytime]

Found this similar situation at my grandparents house in the panhandle. National builder. Front door outside gfci outlet. Screwed to osb with no box. Then by way of bell extender ring out to a light post in uf buried at sod depth. Only reason I messed with it trugreen punched through the uf aerating the soil

 

[kwired]

Yes, I realize that. Now look at that 12" fixture that overlaps the required box by 4" on all sides. See those fixture wires that run out to the lamp holders? Is there a box behind them? Anything besides sheetrock?

Sheetrock, plaster, tile, etc. is at least non combustible, what if you are on a combustible finish was something that always came to my mind?

 

[Poweranytime]

Osb and a framed wall cavity is a perfect scenario. Boxes protect connections and stop arc and spark from lighting this tinder

 

[Poweranytime]

Look at my profile picture. Found this gem in a microwave cabinet on an estimate for some u/c lights

 

[jmellc]

Look at my profile picture. Found this gem in a microwave cabinet on an estimate for some u/c lights

I’ve seen so much of that kind of trash, I barely notice it any more.

 

[ptonsparky]

I’ve seen so much of that kind of trash, I barely notice it any more.

Yes, it has to be pretty bad to stand out anymore.

 

[Poweranytime]

We notice all of it. More work while I'm there keeps schedule full and marketing expenses low