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Leigh Simpson

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The water pipe to the single family dwelling is plastic. All interior piping is PEX. Based on Table 250.66 of the 2020 NEC where do I bond and what size to a 400 amp service? There is gas piping to the house.
 
Dsg319 said:

Article 250 Grounding and Bonding Sticky

This is a nice reference: https://www.inw-training.com/site/images/Documents/Grounding%20&%20Bonding%20Mind%20Map.pdf I'm thinking Mike Could make something like this and have it posted here as a reference sticky.
forums.mikeholt.com
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Table 250.66 would tell us to run a 1/0 copper to the water pipe, but this makes no sense because there is no conductive material. Also, bonding the hot - cold at the water heater makes no sense. But would you bond to the gas piping? I am confused?
 
Leigh Simpson said:
Table 250.66 would tell us to run a 1/0 copper to the water pipe, but this makes no sense because there is no conductive material. Also, bonding the hot - cold at the water heater makes no sense. But would you bond to the gas piping? I am confused?
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Are you an electrician? How to properly ground and bond a typical service should be pretty obvious.
 
texie said:
Are you an electrician? How to properly ground and bond a typical service should be pretty obvious.
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Yes, to your question. I am not speaking about grounding, but bonding the water. If it is obvious, where would you land your 1/0? Normally, the gas is bonded/grounded at the water heater, but this cannot be done in this situation because of the PEX piping.
 
Go back further and read what it says in 250.50 an 250.52.

You must have a grounding electrode system, but if you have no qualifying water piping then you certainly don't have to connect to it.

Basically you must connect to qualifying structural steel and water piping and concrete encased electrodes if they are present. Most other electrode types are intentionally put in place if there is nothing else naturally available or if supplementation is necessary.
 
You bond to bring everything to equal potential. If something is non conducive there is no chance for it to become energized, so there is no point to bond it.
Hope I said that right just woke up
 
Yes, I read you loud and clearly about "grounding." It makes no sense to use Table 250.66 in this situation, so we can only use 250.66 (A). And since there are two ground rods at this dwelling a #6 copper is all that is required for this 400 amp service. What would you size for the gas bonding? It is required in this jurisdiction.
 
AC\DC said:
The EGC on your equipment that the gas is feeding would take care of that
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I agree with you, so that if the inspector insists and wants to see an outside bonding wire on the gas pipe it will be a #14 ground wire, since the furnace is on a 15 amp circuit.
 
Leigh Simpson said:
I agree with you, so that if the inspector insists and wants to see an outside bonding wire on the gas pipe it will be a #14 ground wire, since the furnace is on a 15 amp circuit.
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Not required by the NEC, is this a local code amendment? If there is some types of CSST that may require an external bonding conductor.
 
Per International Fuel Gas Code (IFGC) 310.1 and 310.1.1 basically states if gas piping other than CSST is electrically continuous and connected to an appliance that contains an EGC then additional bonding is not required. Now CSST must be bonded at its manifold with a minimum #6 cu or #4 al bonding conductor. The above is also, referenced in the IRC as well.
 
JGinIndy said:
Per International Fuel Gas Code (IFGC) 310.1 and 310.1.1 basically states if gas piping other than CSST is electrically continuous and connected to an appliance that contains an EGC then additional bonding is not required. Now CSST must be bonded at its manifold with a minimum #6 cu or #4 al bonding conductor. The above is also, referenced in the IRC as well.
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. . . even with a flexible gas connector? Would this compromise the bonding resistance?
 
Leigh Simpson said:
. . . even with a flexible gas connector? Would this compromise the bonding resistance?
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According to the American Gas Association (AGA) if the bonding mentioned above is all met then the up to 6’ of Flexible Appliance Connector (FAC) is acceptable to maintain the continuity.
 
Your house isn't a swimming pool, so you don't bond the water. You bond the metal water pipe system if it has one. You have all plastic piping, so no bonding of the water piping is required. You probably have nothing to do to comply with 250.104.
 
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