GF performance testing

[Wilg]

Just wondering what other inspectors/localities are getting if/when GF testing is required per 230.95(C)

To be honest many of our local electrical contractors have never heard of it or been required to do the tests. Just asking if this is common across the land.

Thanks

 

[texie]

Just wondering what other inspectors/localities are getting if/when GF testing is required per 230.95(C)

To be honest many of our local electrical contractors have never heard of it or been required to do the tests. Just asking if this is common across the land.

Thanks

Our experience tells me that, based on the number of these that we find are miswired, damaged, wrong settings, etc., this is a real problem. Yes, many contractors/electricians are not well informed on the subject which leads to problems. We are considering requiring 3rd party testing by the manufacturer or NETA certified contractor using current injection. Waiting to see how the 2017 NEC handles this as there is a proposal to make changes in the code language regarding this before we do anything.

 

[zog]

Just wondering what other inspectors/localities are getting if/when GF testing is required per 230.95(C)

To be honest many of our local electrical contractors have never heard of it or been required to do the tests. Just asking if this is common across the land.

Thanks

This is a very common test for testing companies, usually the EC's sub them to do this test since it requires the right test equipment and know how.

 

[jim dungar]

Just wondering what other inspectors/localities are getting if/when GF testing is required per 230.95(C)

It seems many of our contractors use the simple 'push to test' button.
It also seems many of our AHJ's do not accept the 'button test' as meeting the 230.95, so they are denying 'occupancy permits' to the building.

 

[mgookin]

It seems many of our contractors use the simple 'push to test' button.
It also seems many of our AHJ's do not accept the 'button test' as meeting the 230.95, so they are denying 'occupancy permits' to the building.

That test button is a hack. There's an internal resistor between the load side hot and line side neutral. Pressing the button makes the circuit. You're only testing the internal coil and release mechanism; you're not testing the circuit.

 

[GoldDigger]

That test button is a hack. There's an internal resistor between the load side hot and line side neutral. Pressing the button makes the circuit. You're only testing the internal coil and release mechanism; you're not testing the circuit.

On the contrary, the current flowing in the test resistor does not directly activate the release coil. It provides a test imbalance in the sensing coil which is indistinguishable from a leakage imbalance. That tests the sense amplifier as well as everything after it.
The test button on an AFCI, on the other hand, does not create a sample arc signature. It just inputs a command to the imbedded microprocessor to open the breaker.

 

[mgookin]

... the current flowing in the test resistor does not directly activate the release coil. It provides a test imbalance in the sensing coil which is indistinguishable from a leakage imbalance. That tests the sense amplifier ...

That's how I understood it. You word things better than me.

.... That tests the sense amplifier as well as everything after it.
...

But you got me there. Are you saying that popping that test button affirms there are no crossed/ open/ etc neutrals, etc. downstream on the branch circuit?

 

[iwire]

It provides a test imbalance in the sensing coil which is indistinguishable from a leakage imbalance. That tests the sense amplifier as well as everything after it.

Typically the CTs are remote mounted and I do not see how the test button is testing that remote wiring and installation.

For instance a CT installed the wrong direction etc.

 

[zog]

On the contrary, the current flowing in the test resistor does not directly activate the release coil. It provides a test imbalance in the sensing coil which is indistinguishable from a leakage imbalance. That tests the sense amplifier as well as everything after it.

I think you are talking about a GFCI? Different animal than GFP

 

[GoldDigger]

That's how I understood it. You word things better than me.




But you got me there. Are you saying that popping that test button affirms there are no crossed/ open/ etc neutrals, etc. downstream on the branch circuit?

No. I was referring to the rest of the mechanism in the GFCI device beyond the sense amplifier. Such as the release coil and moving contacts.
The test button does not check the ability of the device to detect an extra ground-neutral bond even when no load current is flowing. But the typical plugin tester does not test for that and I cannot say whether any particular 3rd party verification protocol tests that either.

 

[Hendrix]

Just wondering what other inspectors/localities are getting if/when GF testing is required per 230.95(C)

To be honest many of our local electrical contractors have never heard of it or been required to do the tests. Just asking if this is common across the land.

Thanks

Don't see too many services that large, but when I do I require a written report for the testing.

 

[Wilg]

Thanks gang, just get worried when we get blank stares when mentioning that requirement. Keep telling them we don't write the code but if it's in there it's probably for a good reason. Obviously not enforced consistently in our part of the world.

 

[jim dungar]

That test button is a hack. There's an internal resistor between the load side hot and line side neutral. Pressing the button makes the circuit. You're only testing the internal coil and release mechanism; you're not testing the circuit.

The OP was about 'service rated GFI' not simple GFCI devices.
Depending on which parts are used and how the GF system is interwired, the button may actually test all of the components. However the NEC asks for systems to be tested not just the components.