GFCI at stainless steel counter

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071145

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A stainless steel counter of @ 18 feet in length has a small stainless sink in one end.
The stainless sink does not appear to be insulated in any way form the stainless counter.
The area where counter located is not a kitchen (resdential or commercial).
There are several 120V-20A receptacles @ 10" above the back of the counter back splash in a sheet rock wallalong the counter.
The receptacles within 6' of the sink are required to be GFCI.
Would the entire stainless counter be considered part of the sink since both the sink and counter have same potential to ground?
Thus are all the receptacles required to be GFCI no matter how far from the sink they are?

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You make an interesting observation, however the code does not make that connection. If not a kitchen, gfci protection is not required.
 
Ditto, there is no 6' GFCI rule for this installation. That doesn't mean that installing GFCI protection would be a bad idea.
 
071145 said:
The receptacles within 6' of the sink are required to be GFCI.
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No they're not. Are you thinking that everything within 6 feet of a sink, anywhere, anytime, needs a GFCI? It's a common notion, but it is not correct. For non-dwelling units, the only things requiring GFCI are kitchens, bathrooms, rooftops, and outdoors in public spaces.

That said, it is not a bad idea. It's just not required by the code.

In general, I believe the 6 foot rule (in those locations to which it does apply) deals with the possibility of an appliance (which normally come with 6 foot cords) falling into a sink full of water. You don't have that concern for the receptacles that are farther from the sink than the normal length of a power cord.
 
iwire said:
What is a wet bar? Could 210.8(A)(7) apply?
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Well, the OP did say this was not a residential kitchen. But there is nothing to say that it is not in a residential basement, or located elsewhere in a dwelling unit. So it is a fair question.

But to me, a ?wet bar? is all about booze. It is a place that has a sink, a faucet, a countertop surface, and storage for bottles of liquor and glasses.
 
charlie b said:
In general, I believe the 6 foot rule (in those locations to which it does apply) deals with the possibility of an appliance (which normally come with 6 foot cords) falling into a sink full of water.
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I always thought it had to do with armspan, like the 3' minimum on service drops near windows.
 
Because if this is a typical installation of say... 80 rooms with 4 of these counters each, in a new science lab at Yale, that's 320 x whatever number of outlets are along each 18' counter. Now you're talking bucks, and not knowing the right answer will mean the difference in being awarded the bid or not.
 
ryan_618 said:
Its worth noting that it will be required in 2008.
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Code reference?

As I'm hearing this, the receptacles within 6' of the sink will be GFCI protected.

Why are we concerned about a conductive countertop, leading some to the conclusion that GFCI beyond 6' would be a good design choice? :confused:
 
210.8(B)(5) Sinks ? where receptacles are installed within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside edge of the sink. [ROP 2?81]
Exeption No. 1 to (5): In industrial laboratories, receptacle used to supply equipment where removal of power would introduce a greater hazard shall be permitted to be installed without GFCI protection. [ROC 2-44]
Exception No. 2 to (5): For receptacles located in patient care areas of health care facilities, other than those covered under 210.8(B)(1), GFCI protection shall not be required. [ROC 2-57]
 
Perhaps i over stated the need for a lab to gfci protect some outlets on a lab table.I seen it as a 6 foot rule and protected the 2 within 6 feet and the others. Did i over protect ?
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
Perhaps i over stated the need for a lab to gfci protect some outlets on a lab table.I seen it as a 6 foot rule and protected the 2 within 6 feet and the others. Did i over protect ?
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I think you did. But I also think that is not evil. Indeed if you did it by using separate GFCI receptacles for the first two, and fed other receptacles from their load terminals, there would be no extra costs.
 
georgestolz said:
Why are we concerned about a conductive countertop, leading some to the conclusion that GFCI beyond 6' would be a good design choice?
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We are not. Or at least I am not, and I think there is no need for anyone to be so concerned.

ryan_618 said:
210.8(B)(5) Sinks ? where receptacles are installed within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside edge of the sink. [ROP 2?81]
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For the metal countertop described in this thread, the ?outside edge of the sink? is not the ?farthest point of the continuous metal countertop surface.? Nor do I suggest that anyone has said it was. But to be clear, the concern that brings GFCI to the party is the possibility of someone dropping stuff into water, not someone touching a metal countertop.

Do you think that the metal countertop surface is required to be bonded, thus eliminating the shock hazard, by 250.90?
 
I don't think a countertop ever needs to be bonded. If there is a concern because metal electrical apparatus are mounted to the countertop, then it is a non-issue, because it will be bonded by metallic continuity. I hope that there is never a code rule that requires to bond things like a countertop.
 
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