GFCI for Washing machine

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green2012

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highland park, il
I always thought it was ok to eliminate a gfci in an unfinished basement if it was a single receptical feeding 1 motor driven unit. I replaced a receptical for a washer and dryer with a GFCI and it wont stop tripping. We plugged in other things to test the gfci and it seams to be working fine. The washer runs for a short period of time then trips the outlet. The washer is about 5 years old. Its in an unfinished basement and a foot from a sink. Exception? Cant please the inpector and have the unit work lol.
 
green2012 said:
I always thought it was ok to eliminate a gfci in an unfinished basement if it was a single receptical feeding 1 motor driven unit. I replaced a receptical for a washer and dryer with a GFCI and it wont stop tripping. We plugged in other things to test the gfci and it seams to be working fine. The washer runs for a short period of time then trips the outlet. The washer is about 5 years old. Its in an unfinished basement and a foot from a sink. Exception? Cant please the inpector and have the unit work lol.
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First thing is you most likely have a fault condition in the washer and the GFCI is just doing what it is supposed to do. Unfortunately it is hard to convince appliance repair guys something is wrong if the thing actually runs and does what it is supposed to do, so you may have to find the problem yourself. Haven't had to do so with a washer but have with refrigerators and freezers a few times. Defrost timers and elements like to sneak up on you but are not on all the time so the problem is not that obvious. Look for something in the washer that is not necessarily on all the time but is on later in a wash cycle.

Second thing is all the exceptions from GFCI there were a few years back are all gone. No more dedicated non GFCI protected receptacles in places that otherwise required GFCI like there used to be. Even if you are only on 2008 NEC I think they are all gone.
 
Yea I noticed all the exceptions are gone. The people are selling thier place so they basically have washed thier hands of the issue. No pun intended. They said that the new owner insisted on a gfci and that what they got. The fact that the washer wont run on it isnt thier concern. Its up to code and I wasnt paid to fix the washer... All is well. Thanks for the responses.
 
green2012 said:
Yea I noticed all the exceptions are gone. The people are selling thier place so they basically have washed thier hands of the issue. No pun intended. They said that the new owner insisted on a gfci and that what they got. The fact that the washer wont run on it isnt thier concern. Its up to code and I wasnt paid to fix the washer... All is well. Thanks for the responses.
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If it makes any difference I had a brand new, large exhaust fan that was tripping a gfci receptacle that was protecting the circuit. I changed the receptacle out and installed a GFCI breaker and had no other problems. The receptacle was seeing an imbalance when the fan would start but with the breaker it has a higher limit and would hold.
 
Let me guess, it trips right after the washer has filled with water?

The fill solenoid seems to produce a kind of high inductive kickback right when they kick off and if you have installed one of those off brand GFCI's made in China like from Menard's, you set yourself up for problems like this go and get a Leviton GFCI receptacle and it should stop the tripping problem, if that doesn't work then there is a leakage problem with the washer (current to ground, not water)

If this is an older washer it is common to find that water and soap has spilled down inside of it and soap being very conductive can cause the leakage I mention above, if you find its not an inductive problem and more of a current leakage problem then you will have to tell the owner it is what it is.
 
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Is washer staying with house or going with previous occupants? May be that once moved nobody has problems anymore.
 
iwire said:
You lost me, all GFCI devices have to meet the same rules. Perhaps it was a defective receptacle.
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While Cebs explanation may be a bit murky and you are most likely correct for the same rules, problems arise when something occurs outside of those rules.

I know that I cannot use Leviton's GFCI devices with an Atlas 6 lamp T5 HO fixture as a load, not even one. Install a GFCI from CWD and the problem goes away. Someone here mentioned RF.
 
GFCI's are not required in california for laundy circuit for the exact reason of the inductance kick back that tends to trip out GFCI's. Motors tend to cause GFCI's to trip out. The design of the washer and dryer and the design of the GFCI cant seem to coexist.
 
VOICECOILS said:
GFCI's are not required in california for laundy circuit for the exact reason of the inductance kick back that tends to trip out GFCI's. Motors tend to cause GFCI's to trip out. The design of the washer and dryer and the design of the GFCI cant seem to coexist.
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Motors and GFCIs get along fine.

Pool pumps

Hot tubs

Any equipment on a construction site

My own sump pump



There is no reason at all a properly working appliance cannot be on a GFCI.
 
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VOICECOILS said:
GFCI's are not required in california for laundy circuit for the exact reason of the inductance kick back that tends to trip out GFCI's. Motors tend to cause GFCI's to trip out. The design of the washer and dryer and the design of the GFCI cant seem to coexist.
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I do no know how dryers and washers are designed for use in California, in NE they work just fine on GFCI. I would venture a WAG that they work very well together in most of the rest of the country. The OPs problem is most likely with the appliance, not the GFCI.
 
VOICECOILS said:
GFCI's are not required in california for laundy circuit for the exact reason of the inductance kick back that tends to trip out GFCI's. Motors tend to cause GFCI's to trip out. The design of the washer and dryer and the design of the GFCI cant seem to coexist.
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Solution to that problem is to stop buying $4.00 GFCI's at the big box stores.

All the reputable brands have very little of those kinds of issues.

From some of the other requirements I hear about in CA I find it a little hard to believe they would exempt laundry equipment from being on GFCI if the receptacle is in a location otherwise requiring GFCI.

There is no requirement in NEC that laundry equipment be protected by GFCI, but there is requirement that certain receptacles in certain locations be GFCI protected regardless of what load is plugged into them. Virtually all exceptions have disappeared over the past few code cycles.
 
kwired said:
From some of the other requirements I hear about in CA I find it a little hard to believe they would exempt laundry equipment from being on GFCI if the receptacle is in a location otherwise requiring GFCI.
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I suspect he has not kept up with the latest requirements, as you hinted at.
 
peter d said:
I always tell people that if a GFCI trips, it's doing its job correctly. :thumbsup:
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And in my experience probably more than 99% of the time that is true. I have had to find faults in appliances myself a few times to prove an appliance repairman wrong as they though nothing was wrong with the appliance and everything wrong with the GFCI. Part of problem is they don't understand what a GFCI actually does.
 
A lot of cities and villages in Illinois are still on 2005 or older NEC rules which only requires them within six feet from the sink in a laundry room. If it's in an unfinished basement then you need one regardless, I don't think there's an exception like the one for refrigerators.
 
kwired said:
Solution to that problem is to stop buying $4.00 GFCI's at the big box stores.

All the reputable brands have very little of those kinds of issues.

From some of the other requirements I hear about in CA I find it a little hard to believe they would exempt laundry equipment from being on GFCI if the receptacle is in a location otherwise requiring GFCI.

There is no requirement in NEC that laundry equipment be protected by GFCI, but there is requirement that certain receptacles in certain locations be GFCI protected regardless of what load is plugged into them. Virtually all exceptions have disappeared over the past few code cycles.
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Absolutely agree. The cheap chinese manufactured GFCI's have given me nothing but trouble. Buy name brands like Leviton, PS, Hubbell. The few bucks saved are vastly overwhelmed by the cost of a call back.
 
iwire said:
I suspect he has not kept up with the latest requirements, as you hinted at.
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here in Los Angeles which is a small little city in California yes GFCI's are now required for laundry areas. If there is water in the vacinity they are required. They(inspectors) are not concerned about what is plugged into them. And I agree the better brang Gfci's tend to hold up well with washing equiptment. We do tons of old apartments with old washer dryers , not too many problems
 
by water in the vicinty meaning a sink or if receptacle is readily accesible as in above the washer rather than behind it and thats even without a sink nearby
 
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