Ground rod driven for pool pump

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MKinnes

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I had an inspector say "he'd like to see" a ground rod driven and the solid #8 run to the pool pump motor connected to it. This seems like an exceptionally bad idea to me. Can someone please give me feed back on this because I haven't responded to his request yet.
 
I don’t see any danger in his suggestion, nor do I think his suggested installation is itself a violation. But it is also not a requirement. Nor does it add to the safety of the installation. What this tells me is that this inspector has no idea of how grounding works.

My response would be, “Thanks for telling me what you would like to see. I have decided not to do it, because the code does not require it, because it will have no impact on the safety of the installation, and because I do not believe in wasting my customer’s money."

Of course, I would not have to live with the consequences of being rude to this inspector, and you would. So be nice, but be firm.
 
I completely agree with Charlie. Positively reject this "suggestion". I personally feel the exact response Charlie gave is completely appropriate...
 
I would see a potential for danger if he wanted this in lieu of an equipotential bonding system
 
Is this an inground pool? If so it is already installed in the earth, with an equipotential bonding grid. How much more "grounded" can you get? Ask the inspector what additional safety will be provided by the ground rod? Will it assist in tripping an overcurrent device? If he thinks it will, you will know that you are dealing with someone that does not understand grounding.
 
If you installed the ground rod, you would then be obliged to tie it in to the house GEC. This would mean more trenching, etc. This inspector appears to be in need of some code classes.
He's wrong, everybody who responded has a handle on this. Hey, that's the hard part about combo inspectors, they can't know everything, but I'm sure that if you have a short conversation about it you should be OK. Just be sure to be tactful and respectful.
 
It is above ground. The message on got on my voice mail was that he would like to see one driven to help the ground fault to open up. Also he is a new inspector and I'd rather not pick a fight with him if I don't have to
 
There is no code requirement for a ground rod at a pool pump motor.
Point out that, per section 90.3, the rules in 690 modify the rules in 250.
While 250 allows this type of ground rod, basically anywhere you want, per 250.54, its a waste of time money and effort.
Ask the inspector what the objective is...
 
MKinnes said:
It is above ground. The message on got on my voice mail was that he would like to see one driven to help the ground fault to open up. Also he is a new inspector and I'd rather not pick a fight with him if I don't have to
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Well, with that statement, he shows that he needs some grounding classes, the ground rod will play no part of operating or opening (at our voltages) an OCPD in a fault.

Roger
 
roger said:
Well, with that statement, he shows that he needs some grounding classes, the ground rod will play no part of operating or opening (at our voltages) an OCPD in a fault.
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Absolutely true. Consider this: Take a 120 volt source, and use it to push current through a ground rod that has a ground resistance of 25 ohms. What current do you get? 120/25 is 4.8 amps. Ask the inspector how that is going to help trip whatever size breaker is feeding the pool?s electrical equipment. To trip a breaker fast enough to prevent an injury to a person, you need a current many times the rating of the breaker. That is the function of the Equipment Grounding Conductor. It has a resistance well under a tenth of an ohm, and will result in a fault current over 1000 amps. An extra 4.8 amps going through a ground rod will not have any influence at all.
 
I absolutely agree that this ground rod is not required, however:

With a proper EGC and required bonding, this ground rod is essentially irrelevant, but a normal 8' ground rod in soil will certainly couple enough current back to the source to be able to trip a GFCI breaker. Even a 1000 ohm resistance to ground would trip a GFCI.

-Jon
 
winnie said:
I absolutely agree that this ground rod is not required, however:

With a proper EGC and required bonding, this ground rod is essentially irrelevant, but a normal 8' ground rod in soil will certainly couple enough current back to the source to be able to trip a GFCI breaker. Even a 1000 ohm resistance to ground would trip a GFCI.

-Jon
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Jon-- most pool pumps do not require GFCI breakers so it would have to trip a standard breaker
 
MKinnes said:
It is above ground. The message on got on my voice mail was that he would like to see one driven to help the ground fault to open up.
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Since (as Dennis mentions) the pool pump likely doesn't have a ground fault breaker, there is at least one more level of misunderstanding going on here....
 
winnie said:
. . . but a normal 8' ground rod in soil will certainly couple enough current back to the source to be able to trip a GFCI breaker. Even a 1000 ohm resistance to ground would trip a GFCI.
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True, but the 1000+ amps flowing through the EGC at the same time might also ?help? trip the GFCI breaker. :rolleyes:
 
My thoughts are as mentioned..... A NEW INSPECTOR.....give Him or Her a break and educate them, show them the Article numbers, carry an NEC with you and they will respect you and work with you in the future.....in a few more months or years they may know the NEC better than you....never know.
 
earshavewalls said:
If you installed the ground rod, you would then be obliged to tie it in to the house GEC. This would mean more trenching, etc.
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Why would this need to be connected to the house grounding electrode system? Wouldn't the additional rod be a supplementary grounding electrode?
 
And the Mike Holt seminars include a full color text that can be carried with you to help illustrate the installation.
 
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