Grounding bed sheets- come on man, is this snake oil?

[letgomywago]

Can I have ground beef bed sheets

 

[jaggedben]

I believe in the concept that if you take the residual voltage off your body, ...

What's it residual from?

 

[winnie]

I believe in the concept that if you take the residual voltage off your body, you reset the secretions of your adrenal gland to sync with a circadian cycle.
I've experienced it with my mother, so I have to relate my experience.

I'm going to call the above out as unsupported nonsense.

What do you mean by 'residual voltage off your body'? Remember that voltage is always between two points or relative to a reference point.

What do you mean by 'reset the secretions of your adrenal gland'? What should they be, and what is the measured change in such secretions without 'grounding'.

I learned how to run barefoot 15 years ago, and as a result I heard alot about the benefits of being grounded. So I bought a "grounded bedsheet kit" from a Dr. Mercado that came with a plug that goes into your receptacle and uses the ground of the third prong, and/or an 18" ground rod for homes without a 3-wire system. There's also a fuse in between the connection to prevent any lightning from striking an individual.
My mom was 86 at the time, and always complained about arthritic pains that would prevent her from getting out of bed in the morning. So I put the kit on her bed, and within three nights she said her arthritic pains were gone. Six weeks later they returned, because the lady who changed the bedsheet didn't reconnect the cable. The bedsheet is conductive and comes in contact with the feet. Six months later her pains came back. She checked the clip and it was on, so she followed the wire out the window to the 18" ground rod and saw where the lawnmower hit the connection and knocked it off the ground rod. I fixed it, and she was good. She lived another 5 years and always had the grounded bedsheet.
I saw it so I gotta say it!

I'm going to call out the above as real anecdote. You really experienced this, and I will not dismiss your lived experience simply because I can't posit a mechanism for how it could work.

This is often the case with pseudoscientific treatments. Someone tries some off the wall idea, and it _works_ . It might simply be luck; the person would have gotten better anyhow. It might actually have a benefit by some missed but well understood mechanism. It might have benefit via some completely not understood mechanism. It might have benefit only because of the placebo effect.

Then people steeped in current understanding of science poo-poo the concept, and use coincidence (luck) or placebo effect to _dismiss_ the concept out of hand. And honestly they are _probably_ right. Supporters of the off the wall concept do a bunch of things which make this worse. First they come up with some sciency sounding BS which they claim as their 'theory', even though the core understanding is clearly wrong. Next they don't do proper _blinded_ studies to demonstrate the effect they are proposing. Belief and bias are huge problems when doing science, and it takes lots of work to eliminate this from a good study. Finally the marketing people jump in and use the sciency BS to sell product, and whenever someone points out the lack of rigorous study they flip the burden of proof over and basically say 'you have to prove it doesn't work' rather than doing the hard work of proving value.

This doesn't remove the _fact_ that you experienced a beneficial effect, and even had a bit of natural experiment where unintentionally removing grounding was correlated with loss of benefit. Honestly I'm considering trying 'grounding' for myself. But don't confuse personal experience of an effect, data on a population about that effect, and the mechanism by which that effect might occur.

-Jonathan

 

[BarryO]

What do you mean by 'residual voltage off your body'? Remember that voltage is always between two points or relative to a reference point.

Ya beat me to it. Voltage is a potential difference between two points. Depending on what it's being measured to, the voltage of my body is 0, 120, 7200, 10,000,000, etc. The last one is the (very approximate) voltage of my body when I'm outside during a thunderstorm, with respect to the cloud overhead.

 

[Speedskater]

Ya beat me to it. Voltage is a potential difference between two points. Depending on what it's being measured to, the voltage of my body is 0, 120, 7200, 10,000,000, etc. The last one is the (very approximate) voltage of my body when I'm outside during a thunderstorm, with respect to the cloud overhead.

The 0, 120 & 7200 are AC voltages.
The 10,000,000 is voltage potential. Can't call it Direct Current, because if there is any current flow from that thunderstorm to your body, well you are dead.

 

[jaggedben]

The 0, 120 & 7200 are AC voltages. ...

They could be anything, really, that's the point.

 

[winnie]

A few more thoughts:

1) When moving around in bed, it is pretty common to build up static charges. Maybe the zaps from normal sleep movement cause problems, and 'grounding' changes this for the better. However if this is the case, I'd think equipotential bonding is more important than grounding.

2) Atmospheric electricity and atmospheric ion current flow are real. I've not double checked the wikipedia article ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_electricity ) but it fits with stuff I remember reading in Scientific American years ago. They mention roughly 100 V/m as the DC potential as you go up from a flat surface, and 2pA/m^2 of ion current flowing normal to that flat surface. Perhaps this ion current through the body is actually important in a way we don't understand. But if this ion current is important, then I'd expect insulating material _above_ the sleeper to also influence things, not just the connection to earth below the sleeper. 2 pA/m^2 of ion current is pretty tiny, and might just flow through building materials, but I'm just handwaving ideas here.

3) The fuse mentioned in post 58 is an example of BS from someone who doesn't really understand what is going on trying to make money on whatever is happening. (Not the poster, whomever sold the equipment.) The fuse won't make a difference for lightning. Prior to the strike the conductive path is there, changing the shape of the electric field near the ground. If the strike were to somehow attach through the conductive sheet and ground wire, then the fuse will do nothing to stop it. Even if the fuse blows, the strike will simply continue through the vaporized remains of the fuse and wire.

-Jon

 

[kwired]

A few more thoughts:

1) When moving around in bed, it is pretty common to build up static charges. Maybe the zaps from normal sleep movement cause problems, and 'grounding' changes this for the better. However if this is the case, I'd think equipotential bonding is more important than grounding.

2) Atmospheric electricity and atmospheric ion current flow are real. I've not double checked the wikipedia article ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_electricity ) but it fits with stuff I remember reading in Scientific American years ago. They mention roughly 100 V/m as the DC potential as you go up from a flat surface, and 2pA/m^2 of ion current flowing normal to that flat surface. Perhaps this ion current through the body is actually important in a way we don't understand. But if this ion current is important, then I'd expect insulating material _above_ the sleeper to also influence things, not just the connection to earth below the sleeper. 2 pA/m^2 of ion current is pretty tiny, and might just flow through building materials, but I'm just handwaving ideas here.

3) The fuse mentioned in post 58 is an example of BS from someone who doesn't really understand what is going on trying to make money on whatever is happening. (Not the poster, whomever sold the equipment.) The fuse won't make a difference for lightning. Prior to the strike the conductive path is there, changing the shape of the electric field near the ground. If the strike were to somehow attach through the conductive sheet and ground wire, then the fuse will do nothing to stop it. Even if the fuse blows, the strike will simply continue through the vaporized remains of the fuse and wire.

-Jon

My first thoughts when I saw that- that lightning strike traveled several hundred feet through the air but that small gap across the fuse is guaranteed to interrupt this current?

 

[drcampbell]

... Even if the fuse blows, the strike will simply continue through the vaporized remains of the fuse and wire. ...

One of the least-understood aspects of fuse theory: It isn't enough to blow the fuse; it's also necessary to quench the arc. That's why a fuse's DC voltage rating is so much less than its AC voltage rating, and why large fuses are often filled with sand.

 

[Jraef]

So now you can plug your sheets in for nothing more then an earth ground. It's suppose to help you sleep. Although in one review I read. Their was no comtinuity from the plug to the sheet.
Is this snake oil? Or do you sleep on one?
They call it

Grounding Sheet 10% Silver Fiber & Organic Cotton- Conductive with Grounding Cord, Grounding Keep Good Sleep, Natural Health (76x80 Inch）​

Check the link below , they're kind of pricey

Amazon.com

KIND of pricey?

"10% silver thread"
"Item weight 220g"

Ergo, ostensibly there is 22g of silver in there. Silver is currently at $0.88/g, so there is $19.36 worth of silver in this TOP SHEET ONLY (it's not a SET of sheets).

That means you are paying $70.52 for a top sheet. You can buy a LUXURY cotton top sheet for a third of that.

So "pricey" is a little too mild of a description...

 

[PaulMmn]

re: voltage on your body..... because of the 60Hz permeating the world, your body does have a 'charge...' There are control circuits that use the residual charge to activate circuits-- without you touching the control. Search for >wireless capacitive switch<. There are several to choose from.
.
Look up the Theremin (musical instrument). You wave your hands in front of 2 antennae without touching them, and it 'knows' you're there and makes sounds. Now, the Theremin produces a field that you interact with.... I don't know if grounding/earthing yourself would alter the results!

 

[Speedskater]

re: voltage on your body..... because of the 60Hz permeating the world, your body does have a 'charge...'

Your body may well have a DC charge (see post #68) but it won't be 60Hz or any other AC frequency.

 

[kwired]

One of the least-understood aspects of fuse theory: It isn't enough to blow the fuse; it's also necessary to quench the arc. That's why a fuse's DC voltage rating is so much less than its AC voltage rating, and why large fuses are often filled with sand.

I cut open a 1800 amp fuse one time just out of curiosity. The fuse element was several rather fragile links in parallel, so I believe the sand is also partly there just to support these fragile elements in some fuses so they don't fall apart if subject to mechanical shock and vibration.

 

[ggunn]

Your body may well have a DC charge (see post #68) but it won't be 60Hz or any other AC frequency.

Is that an alternator in your pocket, or are you just energized to see me?

 

[jim dungar]

I cut open a 1800 amp fuse one time just out of curiosity. The fuse element was several rather fragile links in parallel, so I believe the sand is also partly there just to support these fragile elements in some fuses so they don't fall apart if subject to mechanical shock and vibration.

No. The sand is in there for arc quenching purposes. It turned into glass during large faults, helping to prevent restrikes. For large fuses, like Class L, it would be very hard to find a non current limiting fuses, without sand, I dont think they have been made for almost 80 years.

 

[mayanees]

How many volts was on your body?

40 millivolts

 

[mayanees]

I'm going to call the above out as unsupported nonsense.

What do you mean by 'residual voltage off your body'? Remember that voltage is always between two points or relative to a reference point.

What do you mean by 'reset the secretions of your adrenal gland'? What should they be, and what is the measured change in such secretions without 'grounding'.



I'm going to call out the above as real anecdote. You really experienced this, and I will not dismiss your lived experience simply because I can't posit a mechanism for how it could work.

This is often the case with pseudoscientific treatments. Someone tries some off the wall idea, and it _works_ . It might simply be luck; the person would have gotten better anyhow. It might actually have a benefit by some missed but well understood mechanism. It might have benefit via some completely not understood mechanism. It might have benefit only because of the placebo effect.

Then people steeped in current understanding of science poo-poo the concept, and use coincidence (luck) or placebo effect to _dismiss_ the concept out of hand. And honestly they are _probably_ right. Supporters of the off the wall concept do a bunch of things which make this worse. First they come up with some sciency sounding BS which they claim as their 'theory', even though the core understanding is clearly wrong. Next they don't do proper _blinded_ studies to demonstrate the effect they are proposing. Belief and bias are huge problems when doing science, and it takes lots of work to eliminate this from a good study. Finally the marketing people jump in and use the sciency BS to sell product, and whenever someone points out the lack of rigorous study they flip the burden of proof over and basically say 'you have to prove it doesn't work' rather than doing the hard work of proving value.

This doesn't remove the _fact_ that you experienced a beneficial effect, and even had a bit of natural experiment where unintentionally removing grounding was correlated with loss of benefit. Honestly I'm considering trying 'grounding' for myself. But don't confuse personal experience of an effect, data on a population about that effect, and the mechanism by which that effect might occur.

-Jonathan

Attached is a subjective analysis of the effects of grounding the human body while sleeping. The study group is small at 12 participants, but the document explains the principle. My experience confirms what the document says and that's why I preach it, regardless of the attached study. Why aren't there more studies? I don't know. All I know is from my mom's personal experience, AND my experience when I lay down in bed. I put a grounded wristband on, and I feel a pulsing through the wristband at the frequency of my heart rate. after a couple minutes the pulsing stops, which I equate to the residual voltage being off my body. Residual from what? Perhaps cell phone towers, perhaps power lines.. my approach is pragmatic. Whatever the source, I feel it's alleviated by grounding my body.

 

[kwired]

No. The sand is in there for arc quenching purposes. It turned into glass during large faults, helping to prevent restrikes. For large fuses, like Class L, it would be very hard to find a non current limiting fuses, without sand, I dont think they have been made for almost 80 years.

I understand that, I just noticed how fragile the links were, I broke some of them just handling the thing I kind of wondered if the sand didn't also provide some mechanical support so to speak.

 

[petersonra]

Attached is a subjective analysis of the effects of grounding the human body while sleeping. The study group is small at 12 participants, but the document explains the principle. My experience confirms what the document says and that's why I preach it, regardless of the attached study. Why aren't there more studies? I don't know. All I know is from my mom's personal experience, AND my experience when I lay down in bed. I put a grounded wristband on, and I feel a pulsing through the wristband at the frequency of my heart rate. after a couple minutes the pulsing stops, which I equate to the residual voltage being off my body. Residual from what? Perhaps cell phone towers, perhaps power lines.. my approach is pragmatic. Whatever the source, I feel it's alleviated by grounding my body.

Have you tried the wrist band without connecting it to earth?

 

[ggunn]

40 millivolts

Relative to what? AC or DC?