hard wire of hot tub

[cutekennydet]

Does art. 680 require a self contained hot tub to be hard wired. I see 680.42(2) aliows cord and plug outdoors but what about indoors? 680.43
says use wirring methods of chap. 3. So am I right to assume I can never use plug and cord indoors?

 

[bill addiss]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Keep reading, just a bit more...
Right below 680.43 if you read the exception it says:

"Listed spa and hot tub packaged units rated 20 amperes or less shall be permitted to be cord and plug connected ..."

Bill Addiss

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

The unit is rated at 40 amps with no internal GFi

 

[Guest]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Sounds like a good fit for a Spa Disconnect GFCI Panel.

 

[bill addiss]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

The unit is rated at 40 amps with no internal GFi

If that's the situation, yes I agree, it must be hardwired.

Bill

 

[canadian]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Wayne ..excuse my ignorance but how is that enclosure you showed wired.Is that a 240 faceless gfi....if so what is the contactor for?And for that matter why the breaker AND the disconnect? I must be missing something Ross

 

[hurk27]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Canadian
The contactor is used to remove all power to a hot tub in the event of a ground fault. If you look closly you will see a single pole branch circuit breaker that is not a GFCI rated breaker but since it is also fed by the contactor it to will be protected by the faceless GFCI the GFCI has contacts that open the contactor. this alows two circuits of differant currant ratings a 20 amp 120 volt and a 50 amp 240 volt all supplyed from one two pole feeder breaker from the main service panel. This faceless GFCI has a dounut on the back of it that has the protected wires ran through Somone posted a photo of one of these in the old forum a waile back.

This is one of those designs that allows you to kill two birds with one stone.

[ November 23, 2003, 12:18 AM: Message edited by: hurk27 ]

 

[hurk27]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Here's a photo of one of those faceless GFCI's with the dounut on the back.

 

[bill addiss]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Ahhhhhh,

Thanks for that Hurk, I never saw one of those before.


Bill

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

It is my understanding that if the tub is rated 40 amps and indoors it must be hard wired. My question is why? what is the difference indoors or outdoors for cord and plug connected. I am sure the code making panel had a reason for requiring hardwire if indoors. Any body know
their reasoning?

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

I forgot to add the reason this came up. I have a homeowner who is set on a plug and cord connection in a basement. He says he refuses to call a electrician if he has to temporarily move the tub. I need to be able to tell him why it is unsafe to use a plug when located indoors. I am sure you guys know what it is like to have the home owner screaming, "why can't I get what I want". Saying the code said so, with no explanation of the hazzard involved, only makes the public harder to deal with. Thanks for your help.

 

[bill addiss]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Personally I would never try to put a cord and plug on something like this anyway. It's likely that any Warranty the Tub has would go right out the window. (Or should I say, down the drain)

Ask the Manufacturer.

Bill

[ November 23, 2003, 01:44 PM: Message edited by: bill addiss ]

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

If it is okay to plug and cord connect outside what is the logic it viol. wty inside. It makes no sense. There has to be a reason for rules.

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

No one has answered my question why is it okay to plug and cord connect outside but not inside?

 

[russ]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

I don't know why? Sometimes it just goes that way.
If anybody figures it out, I'll be glad to find out. As for now you have two choices, either do it according to code or don't. It's a choice we make all day long.

Russ

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Thanks Russ you are right, but the homowner will not except "I don't know why" . They expect us to be able to ans. questions and justify what we do .That is why we get the big bucks LOL.

 

[ryan_618]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

cutekenny: I'm not sure which year this came into being, but if you can find out, try looking at the ROP's for that code cycle. I have found that often that is the only way to determine true intent.

 

[roger]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

We wouldn't have to tell the customer "we don't know why" we would tell them that it is an NEC requirement.

Roger

 

[cutekennydet]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Yea right, and you never heard them ask why the NEC reqires this? When people are spending their hard earned cash they don't want to hear smart answers like the code said so. with no follow up

 

[roger]

Re: hard wire of hot tub

Then ask them why some four lane highways are posted 50 MPH and some are posted 55 MPH, while they stand there with a confused look on their face take the check and leave.

Roger