home inspector saying ground rod clamps must be exposed

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Stevenfyeager

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United States, Indiana
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electrical contractor
I had a home inspector tell me today that the 'new NEC' requires the ground rod clamps to be exposed, above ground. (I had installed two, flush with the ground at a house he re-inspected) My local elec. inspector said I did it correctly. Any thoughts? Thank you.
 
You are correct. How can you have an 8' rod driven into the ground and have 8' buried without being below grade. That's the key. If you use a 10' rod then it may be allowed above ground but generally it needs to have 8' in the ground- translate to- it must be below grade
 
Stevenfyeager said:
I had a home inspector tell me today that the 'new NEC' requires the ground rod clamps to be exposed, above ground. (I had installed two, flush with the ground at a house he re-inspected) My local elec. inspector said I did it correctly. Any thoughts? Thank you.
Click to expand...

he is wrong, also would make it difficult to get all 8' of an 8' ground rod all the way in
 
This all comes from 250.53
(G) Rod and Pipe Electrodes. The electrode shall be installed
such that at least 2.44 m (8 ft) of length is in contact with the
soil. It shall be driven to a depth of not less than 2.44 m (8 ft)
except that, where rock bottom is encountered, the electrode
shall be driven at an oblique angle not to exceed 45 degrees
from the vertical or, where rock bottom is encountered at an
angle up to 45 degrees, the electrode shall be permitted to be
buried in a trench that is at least 750 mm (30 in.) deep. The
upper end of the electrode shall be flush with or below ground
level unless the aboveground end and the grounding electrode
conductor attachment are protected against physical damage as
specified in 250.10
 
This would apply to the OP:

250.68(A) Accessibility. All mechanical elements used to terminate a grounding electrode conductor or bonding jumper to
a grounding electrode shall be accessible.
Exception No. 1: An encased or buried connection to a concrete-encased, driven, or buried grounding electrode
shall not be required to be accessible
Click to expand...
 
glene77is said:
So ? What is the conclusion ?

Are we to use a longer ( 8 foot 3 inch ) ground rod ?
Click to expand...

No, use an 8' rod and pound it below the surface of the earth as far as you want and bury it. The connection to the rod is not required to be accessible after installation. Other electrodes are required to have the connection point accessible.
 
Home inspectors are home inspectors for a reason. Some may disagree, but I feel that a home inspector has no business taking off panel covers, and citing code violations.
Like others have said you are correct. I apologize for the rant, but I tend to grow impatient with home inspectors fairly quickly, and even so much as reading this can set me off....

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
 
HI's like to cover their tails on everything. A friend of mine became a HI and invested over $6K on a computer program where he can load all the photos he takes into each inspected property file and provide descriptions of each discrepancy in detail. I've seen inspection reports that are 60+ pages long. As a rule I generally leave about 4" of a rod showing on an upgrade or new install so that the EI can see that it was installed properly. After the inspection I tell the HO he can either drive the rod(s) down further or cover them with mulch.
 
Stevenfyeager said:
I had a home inspector tell me today that the 'new NEC' requires the ground rod clamps to be exposed, above ground. (I had installed two, flush with the ground at a house he re-inspected) My local elec. inspector said I did it correctly. Any thoughts? Thank you.
Click to expand...
If the HI made a statement without substantiation and then your local electrical inspector confirmed the installation was in fact was correct why did you give any more thought to what the HI said?

Roger
 
goldstar said:
As a rule I generally leave about 4" of a rod showing on an upgrade or new install so that the EI can see that it was installed properly. After the inspection I tell the HO he can either drive the rod(s) down further or cover them with mulch.
Click to expand...

I would dig a hole around it and pound it below the adjacent surface. NJ inspectors are letting you slide with 4" sticking out of the ground?
 
I would post my thoughts on home inspectors but my view of them would more than likely get me booted from the forum.
 
truck41trouble said:
Home inspectors are home inspectors for a reason. Some may disagree, but I feel that a home inspector has no business taking off panel covers, and citing code violations.
Like others have said you are correct. I apologize for the rant, but I tend to grow impatient with home inspectors fairly quickly, and even so much as reading this can set me off....

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
HI have no business citing plumbing, mechanical, structural violations either then.

They are not an AHJ enforcing codes, they are a reporting agency reporting possible concerns for the owner/potential buyers. Sort of no different then having a mechanic look at a car for you for the purpose of telling you what may be problematic. Nobody is under any obligation to fix any problems the HI may report, the HI has no authority to demand something he finds to be fixed. Majority of their reports from an inspection are simply used for negotiating price when someone is buying/selling a home.

goldstar said:
HI's like to cover their tails on everything. A friend of mine became a HI and invested over $6K on a computer program where he can load all the photos he takes into each inspected property file and provide descriptions of each discrepancy in detail. I've seen inspection reports that are 60+ pages long. As a rule I generally leave about 4" of a rod showing on an upgrade or new install so that the EI can see that it was installed properly. After the inspection I tell the HO he can either drive the rod(s) down further or cover them with mulch.
Click to expand...
Unless you are using rods longer then 8 feet, you don't have enough buried rod and are in violation of other sections
 
why not just cite the NEC section that proves HI wrong (cited to the seller or buyer). all they would do at that point would be to remove that item from the ut-o inspection list, etc.

or, does the AHJ have a requirement to have all clamps above grade? if so then it would be obvious you would need the 10ft rod.
 
The thing that I don't get about HI's is that when they make mistakes it usually costs people money yet there is no liability on their part. If the electrician had to be hired to dispute this incorrect nonsense then the HI should pay his bill. Why should the seller have to hire and pay an electrician to dispute information on an inspection report that was completely incorrect? :rant:
 
Anything below $10k in damages is fair game for Small Claims court in my State.

And, I don't believe private home inspectors get the litigation indemnity enjoyed by municipal inspectors.
 
The HI is just a consultant that makes suggestions, how does one prove there is any damages if they suggest to change something that someone else deems is code compliant? The contractors that come in and do what was suggested even if they know what was originally there was acceptable are possibly more in the wrong.

Take your car to a mechanic and he tells you you need to install a new/rebuilt motor, take it to a second mechanic and he tells you all it needs is a sensor replaced, performs the task and it solves the problem. If you paid the first mechanic for his diagnosis are you going take him to small claims court on this?

Remember the HI also is inspecting more then just electrical, and is giving a report on many aspects that may be of concern to a home owner or potential buyer.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
You are correct. How can you have an 8' rod driven into the ground and have 8' buried without being below grade. That's the key. If you use a 10' rod then it may be allowed above ground but generally it needs to have 8' in the ground- translate to- it must be below grade
Click to expand...

So what then is the purpose of an 8 ft ground rod, if you need all 96 inches of it to be below grade, yet you have to have a couple/few inches above grade to attach the wire?

Are nominal 8 ft ground rods, actually 99 inches in length? Or does it usually pass inspection anyway, when only 93 inches are embedded?
 
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