house load advice please !

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Stevenfyeager

Senior Member
Location
United States, Indiana
Occupation
electrical contractor
My customer just had an inground pool installed and an outdoor kitchen. ( house is 200 amp service) The pool company had their own electrician who added a subpanel (by installing twins in a panel that doesn't allow them, which I informed the owner of) Then, I came today to wire the kitchen (only two 120 v circuits), but there is now also a hot tub. Load calc., I come up with 261 amps for the 4000 sq ft house including finished basement. (The only thing I couldn't find today was the duel fuel furnace label that uses gas when below 30 deg. So I put in 30,000 VA for a furnace for now.)
But the pool heater, and pumps are 28,480 VA, and hot tub heater and pump is 12,000 VA. I realize the pool heater and pumps may not be in use when the furnace season is going, but the hot tub usually is.
That's 40,480 VA ! ! That's 168 more amps, right ? Plus he wants me to make room for a 50 amp car charger in the future. Any advice ? Am I over reacting ?
Thank you.
 
letgomywago said:
GE doesn't make "Tandems" and neither did Chalenger. Those minis are also called twins often especially with the challenger since you build the twins out of 2 halfs with a left and right half of a breaker.
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Thanks, I realize some of the questions I ask are ones you all might assume everyone knows
 
Old Crouse Hinds 1/2-size breakers also had a left/right orientation. The bus connection was on the outside of the breaker, and you had to have it correctly sided to fit two together or for replacement.
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IMHO you are over reacting only to the extent that the NEC over-estimates residential loading.

The _actual_ load will be much less than the NEC estimated load.

But as an electrician you _must_ use the NEC calculations. So being fussed by the high load calculation is justified but doesn't need to be a panic.

Perform a detailed load calculation, show the customer and the result, and they need to upgrade their service or install load shedding hardware.

-Jon
 
winnie said:
IMHO you are over reacting only to the extent that the NEC over-estimates residential loading.

The _actual_ load will be much less than the NEC estimated load.

But as an electrician you _must_ use the NEC calculations. So being fussed by the high load calculation is justified but doesn't need to be a panic.

Perform a detailed load calculation, show the customer and the result, and they need to upgrade their service or install load shedding hardware.

-Jon
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I hate it when I'm fussed at! :)
 
I agree with Jon. It will almost certainly be totally fine considering diversity. I personally would not bother upgrading the service, unless the oversight structure is such that you need to show load calculations, or think you might be asked for them.
 
Many poco have a readout for meter usage on their websites. PSE here has the kWhr readings for evey 15 min interval available.
full 200 A would be 48 kW, or a readout for 15 min of 12 kWhrs for a 15 min interval. Have never seen a readout over 5 kWhrs in 15 minutes during last 3 years.

hmm,.worst case own house: 5 T heat pump running, 16A; running 320 A welder, say full on, 60A: oven on preheat, 20A, stove on also, 20A, WH on 25A, big ari compressor in shop running while welding, 24A; 2 clothes dryers running at same time, 45A; 12A water pump running; I wold have to REALLY try to get over 200 A. Never have in 55 years in this house. Have a 55A electric pressure washer, but have never ran it same time as welding <g>

Full time on 50A EV charger might put a house over 200A, but unlikely.

Besides which, poco has 6 houses on the 50 kVA xfmr out on the pad.
 
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