How are you pairing your neutrals?

[VirutalElectrician]

200.4(B) requires you to pair your neutrals in a raceway. Makes perfect sense.​

So after you've pulled 4 different colored hots and 4 white neutrals...How are you determining what neutral goes with which hot?

Are you putting a tracer on each neutral at the panel, then going to each box and marking it with it's associated hot?

 

[infinity]

We use a wire marker to number the neutral to it's corresponding hot leg. You also could just tape them together. Homerun box:

 

[hbiss]

Well, you could put a marker (even slashes with a sharpie) on each end. If you are pulling off reels mark the ends and the reels so that you can keep track before you cut.

Sometimes it's just easier to just trace each out with a continuity tester. Short far end of a white to the conduit then at the other end, test conduit to each of the whites until you find the one.

-Hal

 

[mtnelect]

200.4(B) requires you to pair your neutrals in a raceway. Makes perfect sense.​

So after you've pulled 4 different colored hots and 4 white neutrals...How are you determining what neutral goes with which hot?

Are you putting a tracer on each neutral at the panel, then going to each box and marking it with it's associated hot?

 

[ptonsparky]

We taped them at one end and marked the rolls at the other.

 

[infinity]

We taped them at one end and marked the rolls at the other.

We would do that when pulling in the homeruns. Number each hot leg and tape the neutral to it on the nose end of the pull. Mark the rolls on the feed end and then number everything when you're all pulled in.

 

[VirutalElectrician]

We would do that when pulling in the homeruns. Number each hot leg and tape the neutral to it on the nose end of the pull. Mark the rolls on the feed end and then number everything when you're all pulled in.

Right, that's obvious...I have the wire cart setup with 4 colors and 4 whites, one on each level, then mark before cut....But what about the intermediary junction boxes? I try to leave a loop in each one for future tie-in if needed, and code says if you leave a loop, you have to pair.

 

[VirutalElectrician]

What they should allow, is instead of just white or gray, have white w/black stripe, red w/white stripe, blue w/white stripe, etc.

 

[wwhitney]

What they should allow, is instead of just white or gray, have white w/black stripe, red w/white stripe, blue w/white stripe, etc.

"They" do, except it needs to be 3 stripes. See NEC 200.6(A)(3)

Cheers, Wayne

 

[infinity]

I have the wire cart setup with 4 colors and 4 whites, one on each level, then mark before cut....But what about the intermediary junction boxes? I try to leave a loop in each one for future tie-in if needed, and code says if you leave a loop, you have to pair.

You can just pull on one neutral at time to identify it at the loop.

 

[Little Bill]

You can just pull on one neutral at time to identify it at the loop.

That doesn't always work. Sometimes the conductors can twist around in such a manner as to cause one or more other conductor to move when pulling on just one at the beginning, or end, of the run.

 

[infinity]

That doesn't always work. Sometimes the conductors can twist around in such a manner as to cause one or more other conductor to move when pulling on just one at the beginning, or end, of the run.

Well then you'll have tone them out when they're pulled in to identify which neutral goes with the corresponding hot leg. If you're using stranded wire pulling one at a time usually isn't a problem.

 

[kwired]

mtnelect, I don't like your proposal. Crossed load side conductors on GFCI's cause trip as soon as you put them into service, something the installer should catch when testing to make sure things work.

Should not be causing service calls later on if it was caught at initial installation testing.

IMO if it were a NEC rule it is more of a "how to" rule than a rule written for safety reasons. NEC could do away with a lot of "how to" rules that IMO don't belong in there to begin with.

I don't have much issue with identifying which ungrounded conductror(s) go with which grounded conductor, but do believe there shouldn't be much limitation if any on how to go about doing so. I
I have grouped them with tape or cable ties, used markings, marker labels, would even use white with colored tracers if I had it available. In places where no inspection was to occur I maybe even marked with say red tape to go with red conductor even though some might say that is possibly confused with an attempt to identify as ungrounded, but IMO it is not. But then I am one of those that thinks marking a white conductor with colored tape (where permitted to be ungrounded) is one of the long time dumbest rules in NEC. If you can't tell a conductor landed on a breaker is ungrounded, regardless what color it is, you don't belong in the panel. Is a rule to protect the ignorant/untrained and many them still have no clue anyway.

 

[jaggedben]

Use number markers or different wraps of tape around both hot and neutral, at both ends. (For wraps of tape, e.g. one black wrap, one red wrap, one blue wrap, two black wraps, two red wraps, etc. Or whatever colors you got but I try to avoid green.) When pulling off spools, put the markings on the outside of the spools and then transfer before you cut.

 

[augie47]

What they should allow, is instead of just white or gray, have white w/black stripe, red w/white stripe, blue w/white stripe, etc.

That was allowed years ago then it was changed to the "3 white stripe rule" which, as far as I know, is not available from any manufacturer.
We still have a few contractors that use the "1 color stripe" rule and the inspectors accept it.

 

[Birken Vogt]

NM cable 12-2-2 for instance comes with a white/red stripe. Is this not allowed per current code? Is there THHN available to do this?

 

[infinity]

The old stripe rule required white to be used for multiple systems like 208Y/120 AND 480/277 as long as one system had the neutral identified with a stripe. It was later changed to allow white and grey to be used to identify the system.

 

[jaggedben]

NM cable 12-2-2 for instance comes with a white/red stripe. Is this not allowed per current code? Is there THHN available to do this?

There is this weird item permitting manufacturers identifiers in the 'braid' which sounds really out of date.
I found some striped THHN with google but it strikes me as borderline for code compliance. Now, if they made it with different color lettering and or non-continuous colored markings, I think that should be totally uncontroverisal, and arguably less confusing.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

In the first draft report a new list item (9) was added to 200.6(A) to address this issue.

For conductors with a continuous white or gray outer finish, a single colored stripe, other than green

The panel statement for the change said:

The addition of the list item (9) offers a way to associate grounded conductors of the same voltage system with the circuit conductors where multiple grounded conductors are present such as in a wireway.

 

[Birken Vogt]

I see a few listings on ebay for some white/red and white/blue small THHN, some of it new offered by Nassau and some of it NOS that looks pretty old, so it must be being made and used by a few companies.