How many times to bother a lead?

[mtfallsmikey]

Well Growler...I guess they are #1 in that county, because they do have an established shop, pretty much total hacks for competition. The time to have installed any central heat in that particular house was when she bought it 20 yrs. ago. It would have been easier while the demo was going on. I grew up working in my Dad's business (start date 1964), and we grafted hot water baseboard and forced air systems, as well as plumbing into many older houses like this one. Got taught what I know about electrical work by some old crusty guys on these types of jobs, the ones everyone called "Sparky"...worked hard, drank harder. Takes a real hard-core hardhead to do that. Most youngsters don't want to get involved in rehab work, too "dirty".

 

[satnad]

We were called out to take a look at a basement remodel. I went out, looked it over, sketched a layout, discussed it, and upon leaving, told him it would be a few days before we had a price to him, and he said ok.

Well, a couple of days wound up being about a week, which I do feel bad about. But he wasn't looking to start for a couple months anyway, so I'm not sure if the delay contributed - but I haven't heard a response.

I called the morning after I emailed the proposal and it went straight to voicemail, emailed after a couple days, and then called and caught him "at a bad time" and he said he'd call back in a little bit, he never did.

I waited a day or two, and then sent an email saying that I didn't intend to harass him, but hadn't heard anything definitive and that our SOP was to have a conversation with the customer before walking away. Haven't heard a word.

I am not a born salesman, I don't enjoy bothering people excessively - but I'm just not sure what the status is and would like to scratch this off my to-do list, one way or the other.

How many times would you call/email a potential customer? At this point, I'm ready to let it drift away. Do you have a procedure for this sort of thing?

I never call a customer back ever. Shows that you are begging for a job. If I was to get a little frustrated after no response for a long time, I would leave a message saying that I was now too busy and I would recommend a really EXPENSIVE firm to give him a quote OR one which is extremely cheap. Both will have very good results to make you look better but offer different impacts.

 

[satnad]

This is very true. A few years ago, I wired a kitchen remodel for a home-owner who acted as his own GC. I was never introduced to any of the other contractors, nor shown any plans, but we did a thorough once-over of what he wanted.

About a week after rough-in, I got a call stating that the counter-top receptacles were too low for the new backsplash. I told him that nobody told me the new one would be taller than the old one, and I'd have to charge him to move them.

He said "No, I don't. That's why I hired professionals." I told him that, as the acting GC, coordination between contractors was his responsibility. He balked. Fortunately, the boss (his wife) agreed with me, and I got paid for the re-work.

My counter top receptacles go at 48" to the top of the box - no problem in 35 years!

 

[satnad]

All estimates and bids should contain an expiration date letting the customer know how long the bid is good for. Most customers won't pay much attention to it but it does give the EC an out if he should decide that he is no longer interested in the work.

I have done a job four years after the original bid but we did have to renegotiate the price. The customer did understand because we went from recession to boom times and the price was considerably higher but he could afford it. Alway put a limit to a bid as it is a legal document and without an experation date there isn't one.

I also put in an expiry date and sometimes I do write on it that the estimate is yet to be confirmed. Some people think an estimate is something written in stone! An estimate is something out of the blue which may OR MAY NOT be close to the real price. Now if you call it a QUOATION then be careful it means an exact price!

 

[satnad]

I do that for every estimate I give.

Sometimes my estimate states the price is only good if they have me start the same day I give the estimate.

In other words I present them with a price and a discount if they approve the work and have me start while I'm there giving the estimate.

This has worked well for me. They take a risk if they want to wait and get more bids.

Just the other day I gave a price for a job with a discount if they approved the work and had me start while there.

They asked if they could get more bids since I was the first bid they had gotten.
I said sure but the they would not receive the discount.

They told me to go ahead and start.

That is a good way to give a discount if starting sooner -I do that all the time, however, giving an estimate too quickly may cause you to loose money. I have picked up $300.00 more on a $2,200.00 job in going over details for a day or so and still got the job.

 

[satnad]

That's not free no matter who ends up doing the job.

Not! (Obviously)

Not, again.

Not, thrice.

That is why I only do certain types of work. If you want to SHOW OFF that you are SMART and good at doing everything, you will starve! I pretty well am versed in all aspects of electrical work, however, a type work which people call me only 2 or 3 times a year - I don't bother. In fact right now I only do STRICKLY service upgrades and don't touch anything else and can't keep up! When you do only one type of work you can bid higher and 2 out of 5 you will likely get the job and that job will pay VERY WELL for the running around for the other 3.

 

[satnad]

I agree that you have tried to contact the potential customer enough.
The ball is in his court now he will have to decide. I wouldn't waste any more of my time with this guy. I had a simular situation last week. Went out to estimate building a 200 amp service and wiring in a modular home.
I looked the situation over took notes on needed materials & difficulty of the job. Told the customer I would call him back with a price when i got the job figured. He said fine. I called him back late that evening . Gave him the price.
He said he had to talk to his wife. So I figured that was the end of it.
I marked him off my schedule at this point.I knew my Bid was competitive.
Late the next day He called and to my surprise awarded me the job.
You never know what people will do, Of course I figure he was Bargin hunting. Anymore I just give them my price, They accept or reject.
How ever it goes I just go with the flow. Don't haggle .

In any case NEVER let the customer "piss on your back and tell you that it is raining"! If you show weakness, they will notice. You have to be skilled in a certain way and get to know people. I just saw a job which the customer and I new EXACTLY that I would not do the work! I am still searching for a name to call that feeling - but it is very mutual and it is good because I did not have to waste ANT TIME at least to figure out the price which could take 4 hours on top of already 2 hours wasted. In fact I was correct. The customer has not called back about the estimate - has been 2 weeks already.

 

[satnad]

Apples to oranges. How much time does it take to estimate a driveway?

Hmmm... # of sq. feet and does the sealer go on the blacktop or the lawn?

EXACTLY! I always tell the people the MINIMUM COST for the job. If they accept it then I go and see it. Saves hundreds $ of running around.

 

[satnad]

What was it that made you decide you needed 9 bids? Did you figure ahead of time you needed 9 bids? Where you looking for someone that had a clean truck and seemed like they could communicate effectively and it took 9 pavers to find that? Were there 9 pavers in the phone book and you wanted to meet them all?

If I meet someone who I find out had already more than 3 bids, I drop him or her cold!

 

[satnad]

Seems like your too thin skinned to be in business.

I have to have my driveway done as well, my plan is to mail out to a bunch of contractors, pictures, a print with rough dimensions and my specifications and invite these folks to bid. I will not hide the fact I am getting a bunch of estimates. Any of these people can just toss my invitation to bid in the trash and I would not expect them to call me even though I wasted my time and money sending them the invitation.

If they feel they have to come to the house to look at the job they can do that as well but there is nothing wrong with me looking for the best price.

That is because times are tough, otherwise you would not be let wasting
the time of 9 contractors.

 

[satnad]

I don't think it's really that big of a deal. I could have called the other guys back but I didn't. Whoopdeedo. I did thank them when they came out and as far as I am concerned that's enough. None of them followed up with me either. I guess they didn't really want the job. I could count on my two hands the number of times I have received calls telling me I didn't get the job. It just doesn't happen. If that's sad or not I don't know but it is the way it is.

Hey maybe I'll send them a card. It will have a picture of my new driveway on the front

9 pavers were here
9 pavers came through
one paver got the job
too bad it wasn't you

Merry Christmas!

If they are like me, they probably new after 10 seconds that you may be quite an el chipo and therefore never followed up later! Almost all cheap people have a disadvantage - it is all written on their face! I get a kick out of that a lot - and usually I just move on very quickly but never let them know why!.

 

[satnad]

We have a paragraph in our proposal/contract that specifies expected start time after receiving the signature, typically 1 or 2 weeks, and expected completion within X number of days.

While we like to give every customer the impression they're our best one, to expect you to be sitting by the phone awaiting their call just about borders on psychotic behavior.

I give people 2 or 3 days to decide just for a discount. Sometimes I will insert that after 2 weeks the price will be 10% higher until it reaches 30 days when it expires.

 

[satnad]

I'd send one more email:

Mr Customer:

Your lack of response gives me the impression you have decided to use someone else. If you are using someone else, I wonder if you would be kind enough to share the reasons why. I'm asking this favor of you to help me understand what I could have done better to have been selected to help you on your project. Please don't worry about hurting my feelings, operating a business can be brutal. We strive to learn as much as we can from all of our efforts, including the time we spend with no return on our investment. Your response will help us become better and maybe we can work together on a future project.

Best regards,
George

Or something like " look here sir" do you think I am sitting in my recliner with my feet up waiting for you to call me to do the job?

 

[satnad]

Yes it is abbreviated for baseboard...an old habit for us plumber/HVAC types.
And, Larry....here's the deal...
1. No, I don't have time to deal with it
2. Cannot write off my labor..would have to re-activate my business, do tax returns...yuk!
3. I did my sentence retro fitting HWBB (hot water baseboard) systems into older houses. I'll pay dearly someday from the old hogshair plaster dust, asbestos, PCB's I've been exposed to.

3 guys knocked this job out in less than a week...$3400, new 100 amp sub panel, baseboard heaters, t-stats, wiremold, etc. They did a fairly good job.

I don't think they made more than $18/hour!

 

[satnad]

Wiremold?! The hacks!



J/K I've used it aplenty when I had to.

Apparently some hacks even know how to work with wiremold - I just found that out recently.

 

[electricmanscott]

Well that was interesting. I'll just leave it at that.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

satnad

satnad

You are quite an interesting person.

 

[LarryFine]

Apparently some hacks even know how to work with wiremold - I just found that out recently.

I'm more concerned with the hacks that don't know how to use it properly, yet don't let that stop them.

 

[LarryFine]

Well that was interesting. I'll just leave it at that.

I gotta ask: what was interesting?

 

[iwire]

That is because times are tough, otherwise you would not be let wasting
the time of 9 contractors.

I was not aware that giving contractors a chance to get some work would be a waste of their time. I am not talking about lying to any of them, they would be aware they are in competition with others, if they feel that is a waste of their time they are free to just not bid the work.