I'm here to testify..........a visit to the courthouse

[brian john]

Who are you testifying for Tenant or Management? I work for $60 an hour and court here is usually 3 to 4 hours for minor stuff like that.

Expert witness get in the range of 200.00 plus an hour. You should get at a minimum a full days pay no matter how long you are there, plus expenses mileage and food.

 

[cschmid]

been there done that..I dislike the inside of court rooms..nothing good comes from the experience even if you do not need to go back to collect..which you will most likely have to do..

first how can you tell if the meter has been tampered with..without tampering with the POCO's property..

seems a little off from the start..so how did you become involved with the tenant..Are you in the habit of working for tenants..do you receive payment for the repairs you perform on rental properties by the tenants..do you get permission from the owners of the property to perform repairs..

these are some what of the manor of questions you will receive..and if the tenant loses you will never collect as you are not much of an expert then..

Hey man good luck with that and you have got legal counsel for your self right..

 

[220/221]

Me, to give tesimony about whether or not I found evidence of such

.


Well.....did you?





I was in court this past summer VS the fine City of Phoenix :roll:

Long story but here goes.

I bought a house a couple years ago (at the peak of the market of course).

I planned to fix it and move in. It is in a nice Central Phoenix neighborhood on my business partner's street. I have a place to live and I was in no real hurry so I gutted it, moved some walls, put in all new wiring, HVAC and plumbing, including every bit of under slab sewer pipe..(that was a nice surprise). I had gotten to the pre drywall inspection when I pulled off to work on my cabin (same thing...gut and rebuild).

Some time mid 2008 I started to get letters from the city telling me my permit had expired. I KNEW it was good until Aug 08 so I did what I always do in situations like that. I tossed them in the trash.

They called me on the phone one day and told me that the reason the permit had expired was that I let 180 days lapse without an inspection. Crap I DID go over 180 days after predrywall. Everything was just about done but not quite.

I went down town with my credit card in hand expecting to pay the $250 permit fee again but they added another $500 in BS fees. I asked for an appeal form and they sent me upstairs to the woman who handles them. She told me flat out that I had to pay or they would take me to court and NO ONE ever wins in court. That pissed me off a little bit so I left the torn up appeal paper on her desk and figured I'd deal with it later.

A month later I get a subpoena. I guess it's time to deal with it.

I prepared my defense by looking at the permit. It says "If work ceases for 180 days, the permit is void" I read it several times and said "I think I have a case".

Everyone I talked to with the city told me that an inspection was necessary every 180 days or the permit was void. No one was being logical.

I get a court date about a month before the Aug 08 expiration date and show up with my permit as my only evidence. A guy in a $1000 suit calls me up to the front and tells me that he will postphone the hearing if I wanted to go across the street and pay the $750. He says that the fine is minimum $2500 and implied that it was the smart thing to do. Two city inspectors were at his side claiming that the 180 day rulre was in the building code, not on the permit. Crap There goes my defense. $1000 suit guys turns to $2000 suit guy and asks him to get a code book while the inspector guy tells me that I am resposible to know the code regardless of what the permit says.

I go sit and await 2k suit guys return. If the code says it, I am screwed. 2k guy comes back but there is no conference between them. 1k guy come up behind me just after an actual judge shows up. He is trying to talk me into a postphonement and offering me on last chance to pay the $750. It finally dawns on me that this clown is the prosecutor! I asked him what his role was and he confirmed it. I politely declined his offer and told him it was a matter of principle.

The judge hears one case and takes a break. The $1000 suit prosecutor leaves the room, deferring his upcoming cases to his underling stating publicly that he had seven criminal cases to attend to, implying that he didn't want to waste his time with these petty cases.

New prosecutor woman calls me into a back room along with $2000 suit guy (counsel for the city) and the two inspectiors. The lawyer has the building code book open to the correct section and I am allowed to plead my case.

It says on the permit "if work ceases for 180 days..." it doesn't say "if you don't call for inspection within 180 days". New prosecutor says "he has a point" and almost uttered the "D" word (dismissal) but the lawyer stopped her cold and sent me out of the room.

I am PSYCHED!! I know I am going to kick all their asses.

Two minutes lated the head prosecutor that was too important to deal with me comes storming back thru the courtroom, into the back room.

Crap!! I am screwed again.

Prosecutor dude comes to the door and calls be back. I can't read his face. I don't know what to think. I KNOW that people in his position can be stubborn and I am WAY out of my league here so I am just hoping for the best.

Two prosecutors one lawyer retained by the city and two inspectors are on the clock here. This thing is costing them money. If they fined me $2500 it would barely cover their costs. The lawyer reads the text from the code while the others try to interpet it. Lawyer guy jokes about the way it is written saying "It was written by lawyer, what do you expect". The city inspectors hold strong because that's what they always believed.

They tried to trick me a few times but I usually know what not to say.

After about 10 more minutes the prosecutor determines that they can't prove that work ceases for 180 days and he will have to recommend dismissal. Judge comes in, bangs her gavel and I am happy as I can be. I fought city hall and won convincingly.

Part two is just about as long. My permit is still in the building departments system as "void" so the inspector who was in court called in for a final.

Inspector comes out and red tags it "permit expired/void"

For the next 4 weeks I am on the phone with a dozen different people trying to get them to understand. They keep telling me the same old line about 180 days. They keep trying to squeeze more money out of me to make it go away. I FINALLY get thru to the guy at the top.....the guy they should have put me in touch with at first!. He is going on vacation for a week and will return the day my permit expires. He shows up and redtags me for three items.

1. My water heater T&P pipe terminated 4" from the ground outside. It's is supposed to be 6". I thought it was MAX 6". easy enough.

2. My front porch recep was over 6' whoops...my bad.

3. No address on house.

I tell him that these items would be corrected within the hour and he says to call him directly when they were done. I call him an hour later and leave a message with his secretary AND on his voice mail. I am out of town enjoying my cabin and a few weeks pass. I ask my business partner to check for a green tag again and again. The permit is expired by now so I am thinking I am screwed again. I call head inspector guy one last time and he says "you were supposed to call me"

He's tired of dealing with it so he come out the next day and gives me a green tag and CO.

 

[cowboyjwc]

And if they ask you to just tell the truth, this line always works, "you want the truth? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"

Judges love when you do stuff like that.:grin:

 

[Fulthrotl]

Seriously though....a few years back I had a deadbeat tenent in a rental property I owned. The paperwork was filed with the courts, date was a week or so away. So I'm talking to my neighbor and I mention this deadbeat's "money issues"....the first thing out of my neighbor's mouth:
"Want me to call Vinny and have him fix the front door?"
It was January too
Say me to the neighbor: "I got this one...you can get the next one"

in joisey, no less.... does someone in joisey named vinny mean what i
think it means?

"vinny and a couple of da boyz.... they fixed that door....."

 

[Fulthrotl]

Tomorrow I go to the courthouse .....
:smile:

today i go to the courthouse as well... it'll be the fourth day
of trial, and i am on the jury.... maybe we'll get closing arguments
and can get this thing done today.....

at least i'm not on the other side of the jury box....... :smile:
i need to figure out how to get a can of wd-40 past the metal
detector, cause my chair has a squeek in it, and when i lean back,
it makes a *very rude* sound.....

randy

 

[billsnuff]

so your chair is going full throttle? :grin:

 

[celtic]

in joisey, no less.... does someone in joisey named vinny mean what i
think it means?

"vinny and a couple of da boyz.... they fixed that door....."

Whadda you think?

 

[roger3829]

I have a customer/friend woh wants me to go to court to testify on his behalf. Ex-landlord is suing him.

Situation;

Tenant moving out at end of his lease. Calls power company tells them he will be out of apartment on the 28th, read meter and bill him. Sounds ok.

Power company shows up on 28th and pulls meter to turn off power. Meter socket breaks. POCO informs landlord. Landlord flips. Blames tenant for broken socket!!!

I call landlord and try to explain to him that the meter socket is HIS responsilbility. He flips out on me!!!! Asking me if I was a lawyer too!! He siad tenant had NO RIGHT to shut off power. I tried to explain that the POCO could have pulled that meter at ANYTIME and had the same results. He didn't care, said it was tenants fault.

Told tenant not to worry about it. Tenant gets called to court, not sure yet as to why. This should be fun.

 

[ultramegabob]

Totally illegal and I did not do it. He told me something was wrong and they wanted the service dropped to 120. I thought it was a little fishy he did not want me to go to the apartment. The Service entrance, MDP and group service panels were 1/2 a block from the apartment. So before I did anything I went to the apartment to tell whom ever was supposed to be working that the power was dropping to the 120V and found tenants. I called the jerk and he told me that he wanted them to move out and wanted the range to not work.

So I told the Tenants and we went to court. It would not have worked any way the group panels went to a Sub group distribution panel at each group of 8 apartments then to the internal sub panels. So I would have had to go to the group distribution before I could pull the red leg or in the apartment.

that sounds like a good way to set yourself up for a lawsuit to replace any electronic equipment the tennant may say was damaged when you messed with thier electrical service without contacting them first....

 

[wbalsam1]

Anthropomorphism.

:smile:

Ah, yes. A mule with kindred spirits. :smile:

 

[kid_stevens]

I call landlord and try to explain to him that the meter socket is HIS responsilbility. He flips out on me!!!! Asking me if I was a lawyer too!! He siad tenant had NO RIGHT to shut off power. I tried to explain that the POCO could have pulled that meter at ANYTIME and had the same results. He didn't care, said it was tenants fault.

Sounds like a slum Lord Type A personality.

 

[peter d]

I have a customer/friend woh wants me to go to court to testify on his behalf. Ex-landlord is suing him.

Situation;

Tenant moving out at end of his lease. Calls power company tells them he will be out of apartment on the 28th, read meter and bill him. Sounds ok.

Power company shows up on 28th and pulls meter to turn off power. Meter socket breaks. POCO informs landlord. Landlord flips. Blames tenant for broken socket!!!

I call landlord and try to explain to him that the meter socket is HIS responsilbility. He flips out on me!!!! Asking me if I was a lawyer too!! He siad tenant had NO RIGHT to shut off power. I tried to explain that the POCO could have pulled that meter at ANYTIME and had the same results. He didn't care, said it was tenants fault.

Told tenant not to worry about it. Tenant gets called to court, not sure yet as to why. This should be fun.

Let us know how that turns out. Should be interesting.

 

[c2500]

Ok, here is my court room story....

I am ask to testify against the husband of a former neighbor with regard to his electrical work on a condo. He re-wired the condo, but did not pull permits, and some of the wiring did not work. He also swapped the antique breaker panel with a modern one, and placed it back in its original location (not legal).

Her attorney asks me about the wiring, and I tell them there is a wire lost in the wall, that is why some receptacles do not work. He asks what will it cost to fix? I then comment several thousand dollars. Attorney asks why, I say that is what it will cost to correct the code violations.

Then the husband's attorney pounces. He questions my credentials, for which I tell him I am a licensed builder, as well as residential electrician. Then he says that a panel swap is legal. I say yes it is, if it is a durect replacement, but since the guy rewired the whole condo, he was subject to placing the panel in a legal place. We continue going in circles, with me finally looking at the judge when I have answered the same questions 50 different ways. Finally the judge moves him on, and he harps on some some smoke detectors I installed. I, by then, hated the guy. He ask if I bought the detectors at Winn Dixie? My being the smartass I am said, I don't know if Winn Dixie sells smoke detectors, after all they are bankrupt and no longer open.

We continue arguing for a while, and then he moves on. After I left, the husband has a friend come in and say he did really good wiring. Her attorney of course points out that since the husband is not licensed, he has no standing and his repair plan for the condo is invalid.

It was fun, but it really makes you apprecate being on top of the rules.

c2500

 

[Fulthrotl]

so your chair is going full throttle? :grin:

nothing in a courtroom goes full throttle.

today is going to be day 5 of this. i was supposed to meet someone
in LA today for a job walk. that isn't gonna happen.

i've got a lighting panel to install. that isn't gonna happen.

i've got a commercial garage to make code upgrades to. that isn't gonna...
you get the idea.

oh, boy, though.... i've made $15 a day for jury duty. woohoo.

my bs filter is now completely plugged as a result of participating in this
process. please excuse me while i clean it with a toothbrush.


randy

 

[weressl]

I should have gone with a Badger

Bob Badger

What a striking resemblance! :smile: Not visual, but behavioral......

 

[cowboyjwc]

Badger? Badger? I don't got to show you no stinkin' badger.

Whats the difference between a catfish and a lawyer?



Ones a mud sucking bottom dweller and the others just a fish.

 

[LarryFine]

Why are lawyers buried an extra two feet deep?










Because deep down, they're nice people.

 

[Fulthrotl]

nothing in a courtroom goes full throttle.

today is going to be day 5 of this. i was supposed to meet someone
in LA today for a job walk. that isn't gonna happen.

i've got a lighting panel to install. that isn't gonna happen.

i've got a commercial garage to make code upgrades to. that isn't gonna...
you get the idea.

oh, boy, though.... i've made $15 a day for jury duty. woohoo.

my bs filter is now completely plugged as a result of participating in this
process. please excuse me while i clean it with a toothbrush.


randy

the verdict is in.... yay!!!
a 40 hour week spent in jury duty.... finally done.

a criminal case...
two counts of assault with a deadly weapon on a police officer.

if you search youtube for "roman candle war" you'll see what the
defendant was doing when the police got there. in the midst of a
six beer hot flash, the defendant decided to take on the santa ana
swat team, armed with a roman candle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeWN15SqwJQ

he's been in jail since july fourth, and as he is lead singer of his
psychobilly rock band, his career has been adversely impacted.

so twelve of us had to sit there and try to reach unanimous compromise
on the charges. we succeeded after 8 hours.


randy

 

[billsnuff]

been there, done that

been there, done that

after 2 days in court, then 2 days deliberating, 5 mins from frying this turkey, judge walks in and says she has a plea of nolo contendere. thanks for your service. se ya.

the right to vote and the obligation of civic duty, wonder what we'd do without it.