Inspection rant

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iwire said:
Bureaucratic nonsense.
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Never said it wasn't, but it's state mandated so I don't have much say about it. We actually get audited about once ever two or three years to make sure we are complying. Little things they just write up. If you are really doing a bad job, the worst penelty is that they take over your department and every permit issued must be approved by the state.

We've actually won two state awards for complicance.
 
cowboyjwc said:
Here changing the type of fixture would be grounds for a plan revision as they have to submit energy calcs and the fixtures calced have to match the fixtures installed. Same thing with the A/C equipment.
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So, you would make someone submit revised plans because they changed brands? Even if it's a 2 lamp for a 2 lamp luminary or a 5 ton for a 5 ton a/c?

The even better one is "You actually want them to follow plans?!?" Thank you!:D :cool:
 
Originally Posted by wbalsam1


fenestration,





shockin said:
I guess I need to add that to my vocabulary. Or I could just call them windows and doors so people actually know what I'm talking about.
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Choices:
  1. add the word "fenestration" to vocabulary
  2. do not increase vocabulary as it relates to fenestration and continue to call the arrangement of windows and doors within a building or structure the "arrangement of windows and doors within a building or structure"
  3. have the certainty that you're being understood by adopting #2
  4. live on the edge and adopt #1 ;)
 
DanZ said:
So, you would make someone submit revised plans because they changed brands? Even if it's a 2 lamp for a 2 lamp luminary or a 5 ton for a 5 ton a/c?

The even better one is "You actually want them to follow plans?!?" Thank you!:D :cool:
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The short answer Dan is, Yes.

While I may not worry to much about 2 lamp for 2 lamp as long as all the numbers are the same, the mech inspectors paper work calls for manufacturer and they must match. For the electrical you now have to submit forms for your outdoor lighting as well as for you signage.

if you guys really want to know how bad it is, go to www.energy.ca.gov and look at just the forms that need to be filled out.
 
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If an electrician can not figure out what a basic home needs then maybe they should find other work.
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Yes but it is too late and costly for the buyer or builder when the job is done. Catching these items ahead of time eliminates problem.

No one is perfect and along with myself and I am sure everyone else out there, we have all learned something after we failed an inspection even though we thought we knew what we were doing before hand.
 
ivsenroute said:
Yes but it is too late and costly for the buyer or builder when the job is done. Catching these items ahead of time eliminates problem.
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It is also costly to the customer to require prints drawn up for a simple job.
 
Bob, I'm surprised at you. There is no such thing as a simple job, it may seem like it at the time, but those are the ones that will bite you in the butt.

Got one right now, maybe, maybe, 400 sq ft, I have been out there 5 times and we aren't through rough yet.:rolleyes: :confused:

Now the problems don't have anything to do with lay out or such, but it's still just a simple job.
 
cowboyjwc said:
Had a job one time where it came through plan check 3 times because they didn't want to show a light and a switch at 2 exterior doors. The lady asked me, "if you know they need to be there can't you just call it at rough electrical inspection." I said "ma'am I know exactly what's supposed to be there, those plans aren't for me, they're for the electrician that bids the job then comes out and does the job and then want's $400 in extra because the lights and switches weren't shown on the plans he bid off of and you get mad at me and him because why didn't someone tell you."
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As I'm sure you're aware, here an electrical inspector plays no role in job design as long as it's to basic code minimum. They enforce the NEC and nothing else.
 
Wouldn't having a set of plans make bidding the job that much easier?

We all know a 1200 sq. ft home is not the same as a 1200 sq.ft home.

Someone has to go to the trouble of wiring the place based on the bid ~ that the EC, GC and client all agreed to.

That same plan could be given to the city...at what cost?
For starters, probably less litigation at completion.
 
peter d said:
As I'm sure you're aware, here an electrical inspector plays no role in job design as long as it's to basic code minimum. They enforce the NEC and nothing else.
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I wasn't designing, and it wasn't to code, a light is required at each exterior exit (210.70(2)(b)).

When I plan check you will show the minimum. You can put in as many lights and outlets that you want as long as you show me the required ones.
 
cowboyjwc said:
Bob, I'm surprised at you. There is no such thing as a simple job, it may seem like it at the time, but those are the ones that will bite you in the butt.
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But I know what works, or did work back when I doing that type of work.

I am talking code minimum houses or apartments, no 'E' prints at all, only 'A' prints.

I can't remember it ever coming back to bite us. Now change that to a custom home and I can not see how you could avoid full E prints and have ECs give accurate bids.
 
iwire said:
But I know what works, or did work back when I doing that type of work.

I am talking code minimum houses or apartments, no 'E' prints at all, only 'A' prints.

I can't remember it ever coming back to bite us. Now change that to a custom home and I can not see how you could avoid full E prints and have ECs give accurate bids.
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I was really just busting your :D :D :D 's

I do agree to a point. We used to do "green sheet" around here. Do the work, then draw it and then show the inspector what you did. As long as everyone know's what's required it's not a big deal.

with celtics point, at least you will always be bidding apples to apples.
 
celtic said:
You really think so?
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Yes, at least that was my experience oh so long ago now.

My boss at the time had no fancy excel spread sheets, he looked at the 'A' prints and put a number to it. :smile:

Was it a good number? I don't really know, I know he took pretty good care of us in pay and benefits so I was happy.

I also am fairly certain that if he started demanding full E prints for every job that he would be passed over for more flexible ECs.

Rob's close to you and he does not get E prints. :smile:

infinity said:
Why would a single family dwelling require a plan with receptacle and lighting locations? Even if they were actually on a drawing it's likely that they wouldn't get installed that way when the EC gets to the job in the field. A good EI should be able to just walk through a house and see what's right and what's wrong.
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As a side note I am currently designing a couple of large solar jobs and I am really pushing the limits of how little info I can provide to the EE.

It's not that I am trying to hide things from him, I just have a very tight time frame and don't have the time to make very detailed prints. I am sure he is saying unkind things about me. :grin:
 
tyha said:
you know what it is because people like you that no one can make a living anymore. You hold up the process of some electrician trying to feed his family because of some stupid rules that you just mostly make up as you go. No seriously, that is basically just another builder trying to cut corners and ends up spending twice the time and money in the end. typical, I dont know why a good electrician would even want to work for them.
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Wow, You sound like you have had to deal with plan review a several times. I would like to know the rest of the story that makes you feel this way.
 
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