Inspections

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jumper said:
The installer is still responsible for the work, even if it passes.

Were someone to be hurt or property damaged, the contractor would be held for any criminal or civil penalties.

The inspector would be immune unless severe gross negligence could be proved.

I apologize for my remarks if you did not know this.

It is a basic tenet of law and I mistakenly assumed most people know this, so when you posited the idea of purposely leaving mistakes, I found it silly. Only you can lose if something goes wrong.
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I don't agree that is the case everywhere. Here in new York state it is mostly third party private inspection agencies. They are frequently called "underwriters". I believe they assume some liability for the installation.
 
texie said:
Nope, the electrician shouldn't poke the bear.:)
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Yep.

I pretty much have only three things I say to most inspectors:

1. Yes sir.

2. I will take of that immediately.

3. Would you like cream and sugar in the complimentary coffee I am attempting to bribe you with and please take all the donuts you want.

I get paid to pass inspections, not irritate the inspector.
 
I was going to say what MAC said. I tend to worry about the job is you can't do a simple thing like put in a KO seal or secure a footing by the box. I got asked one time by a contractor how I saw what I saw, and I asked him how he didn't. You've been here for weeks, I just showed up.

You could leave a couple of little things and run into that one inspector that just walks off and tells you to call him when you're done. That will show him.

One thing we always tell contractors here, it's much easier to sign the job card than write a correction notice.
 
cowboyjwc said:
I was going to say what MAC said. I tend to worry about the job is you can't do a simple thing like put in a KO seal or secure a footing by the box. I got asked one time by a contractor how I saw what I saw, and I asked him how he didn't. You've been here for weeks, I just showed up.
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Sometimes, things are obvious to a new set of eyes that are buried in the noise to a person who's been looking at the same thing every day for a month.
 
I have been an inspector for 28 years for a smaller community so I have to inspect everything. I am sure that I have missed an occasion item. I also know that some contractors want to talk through the whole inspection to keep your mind off what you need to be looking at. I do have a couple really good electricians who will occasionally leave something wrong for me to find. It is a game we play however respect each other if I miss it and it gets corrected. I figure it is a learn/learn situation that we challenge each other on code knowledge. We have all learn more by this practice.
I had on inspection that was completed for a service upgrade located in the laundry room. Later that night I responded back with the fire department for a fire which originated in that room. I was paranoid that I had missed something, but it turned out to be a dryer fire due to lint build up. It only takes a couple minutes longer to inspect the best I can and I have even gone back to jobs to confirm my inspection.
 
102 Inspector said:
It only takes a couple minutes longer to inspect the best I can and I have even gone back to jobs to confirm my inspection.
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As long as your are qualified for your position and exercise due diligence in your duties, you are immune from civil and legal liability.

Only proof of gross negligence on your behalf could negate this.

It is not expected that you are perfect and not make a reasonable mistake.

A contractor takes out insurance in order to cover any mishaps or whatever that could occur because of work he/she performs.
 
102 Inspector said:
I have been an inspector for 28 years for a smaller community so I have to inspect everything. I am sure that I have missed an occasion item. I also know that some contractors want to talk through the whole inspection to keep your mind off what you need to be looking at. I do have a couple really good electricians who will occasionally leave something wrong for me to find. It is a game we play however respect each other if I miss it and it gets corrected. I figure it is a learn/learn situation that we challenge each other on code knowledge. We have all learn more by this practice.
I had on inspection that was completed for a service upgrade located in the laundry room. Later that night I responded back with the fire department for a fire which originated in that room. I was paranoid that I had missed something, but it turned out to be a dryer fire due to lint build up. It only takes a couple minutes longer to inspect the best I can and I have even gone back to jobs to confirm my inspection.
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I have been an inspector for only around 11 years in relatively small jurisdictions and agree with the above. We inspectors often say among ourselves though that we can always miss something.

But don't challenge me by saying that everything has been done to code before I begin my inspections.
 
In my three county service area I'm not required to be present for inspections so usually I'm not there because it saves me money on labor. If the property is vacant or the inspection is outside the building, the inspector goes it alone. (I have to make sure it's accessible with an open gate or lockbox code.) If the property is occupied and the inspection is inside, anybody (usually the homeowner or business owner) can escort the inspector. Therefore, I try an make sure everything is good so the inspection passes. Correction notices are just more work (and more expense) for me. I rarely fail inspections now because past failures have taught me how to do things right. And if I'm not sure, I check this forum or call an inspector (or both).

The biggest problems I have are when the inspector fails the inspection because "he heard a dog and was afraid to enter the backyard". (It's always the dog next door.)
 
The law "loves" the term....knowledgeable persons. If you saw a problem and didn't either fix it or report it and it resulted in an injury, fire or worse....you may be held liable as well as anyone else the lawyers can get money from. As a utility tech, I inspected many services that had errors but were tagged "ready for power" by the town inspectors. Ours was a small town, so inspectors were electrical, plumbing, building, etc. The utility is not a code enforcer, but if I found errors such as missing MBJ's, GEG's terminated wrong, green bonding screws installed in sub-panels, etc, I told the electricians to fix it before we gave them power. I gave classes to the inspectors about what I was finding, but I really doubt if they paid much attention. Bottom line is....if you know about an error, don't just ignore it because it's "not your job". Get it fixed. You may save a life......
 
growler said:
I have heard that many times but it is total BS.


An understanding that you are responsible for the job and the inspector isn't will help a lot.
Don't try to use the inspector as quality control (as Tom says) because that will only get you in trouble.
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It's my parents house so trust me I take full responsibility for the work. They wanted to do it un-permitted and I said then they wouldn't get help from me.
As far as quality control, that isn't the case. I don't expect an inspector to see everything as I previously mentioned I simply wanted to know his role, which I do now.
 
meternerd said:
The law "loves" the term....knowledgeable persons. If you saw a problem and didn't either fix it or report it and it resulted in an injury, fire or worse....you may be held liable as well as anyone else the lawyers can get money from. As a utility tech, I inspected many services that had errors but were tagged "ready for power" by the town inspectors. Ours was a small town, so inspectors were electrical, plumbing, building, etc. The utility is not a code enforcer, but if I found errors such as missing MBJ's, GEG's terminated wrong, green bonding screws installed in sub-panels, etc, I told the electricians to fix it before we gave them power. I gave classes to the inspectors about what I was finding, but I really doubt if they paid much attention. Bottom line is....if you know about an error, don't just ignore it because it's "not your job". Get it fixed. You may save a life......
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I tell utility technicians that if they find something I missed please let me know. I may be embarrassed but will be grateful.
 
MattS87 said:
Has anyone else found that their inspector maybe isn't doing their job correctly? What I mean by this is an inspector not noticing a seemingly obvious violation. I understand they have busy schedules and there can be a lot to look at on any given job but isn't the point of the inspection to find our mistakes?
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Yes, all the time. They will ignore bigger violations, and then make up rules for things that aren't violations at all and demand they be corrected. :roll:
 
peter d said:
Yes, all the time. They will ignore bigger violations, and then make up rules for things that aren't violations at all and demand they be corrected. :roll:
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So you knowingly leave big violations, and it's the inspectors fault that it's not found? :roll:
 
electrofelon said:
I don't agree that is the case everywhere. Here in new York state it is mostly third party private inspection agencies. They are frequently called "underwriters". I believe they assume some liability for the installation.
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even 3rd party private sector inspectors are appointed or authorized by a government body
they are likely immune
if not only liable for the cost of the inspection

there is no way to prove the fault was there at the time of inspection
very difficult to make someone liable for work they did not perform or get paid for
 
i'd stay there till i found something and make you stand next to me if you played that game with me....bet you wouldn't do that again....lol
if you know him thats a diff story as i have done that....




MattS87 said:
I was taught to leave 1 or 2 little things for the inspector that could be fixed on the spot as a "feel good". Well I did that today, in obvious places, and he didn't notice. Just got me thinking, had I made a mistake and not known about it would it have been caught, and if not, who would be at fault?
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